Are you struggling to change your eating habits? Melissa Hartwig, the nutritionist and best-selling author of the Whole30 Book – The 30-Day Guide to Total Health and Food Freedom (which has now sold over 2 million copies) shares with you how to forever change your life by changing what you eat.
Free Tools: www.Whole30.com
Are you struggling to change your eating habits to lose weight or you just so frustrated you can’t seem to find a sustainable diet that actually works for you? Well, on today’s show, we’re interviewing the New York Times best selling author of the whole30 book, the Thirty Day guide to total health and food freedom, which has now sold over 2 million copies. Over 2 million copies. Just think about that. Today’s guest has been featured on CNBC wide with Kelly and Ryan, countless media outlets, and now she is right here with us on the thrive time show. Where does it gentlemen mentally prepare yourself for an endless barrage of knowledge bombs compete in today’s interview with Melissa Hartwig.
I don’t know if you can believe this, but we have a unicorn on today’s show. Oh yeah, we are. You mean the best selling author and the nutritionist who has been featured on CNBC live with Kelly and Ryan, countless media outlets, and the CEO Marshal of the whole 30 program. This woman is a hundred percent committed to helping you change your habits as it relates to your eating and your relationship with your food. Miss Melissa, how are you? Welcome onto the thrive time show my friend.
Hello. Thank you so much for having me. I’m really happy to be here.
Melissa Hartwig. There’s so much that has been written about you on the Internet. I would say 99 points seven percent of which is super, super positive. Uh, and so I want to ask you some questions that maybe you haven’t been asked before or try to tap into your wisdom here a little bit. So I’ve heard you say that food is so emotional, so emotional. Why do people after a bad day go into eat a half gallon of ice cream? What’s that all about?
So many reasons. So our relationship with food often goes all the way back to childhood. It’s what we learned as kids. That’s what our parents modeled for us. It’s that every time our parents thought they would take us out for ice cream or you know, they didn’t let us have any junk food at all. So we hid under our bed and ate candy and very often that relationship starts. You know, we couldn’t get dessert until we ate all of our vegetables. And those are really powerful associations. When you also factor in the way today’s modern food is created like created by students to be so salty and fatty and sugary and craveable and they’re designed for us to overconsume and you combine that with our deeply emotional relationship with food. The fact that culture and media have taught us to use food as a reward or treat yourself to use food as comfort or to reward, to relieve anxiety or to self soothe or just show each other love. It’s no wonder that we’re stuck in this really vicious cycle of using food to numb our feelings and then overconsuming and then experiencing the guilt and shame that comes along with it and hating ourselves and stressing about it, which only leads to more cravings. And the kinds of foods we’re eating are keeping us stuck on that cycle.
You are a person who lives what you talk about, uh, you know, you, you, you stay in shape, you eat the way you should, you, you, you, you don’t just teach the whole 30 program but you live it. I have to ask you, how do you know some people eat ice cream to sort of deal with a rough day? They drink a beer to deal with a rough day. They eat a ton of popcorn. So deal with the rough day. How do you deal with food when you have a rough day or how do you deal with life when you have
so? Yeah, I think because food is so accessible and because we’re taught that that’s the Goto, right? You see the commercial with the woman who has a fight with her boyfriend and she reaches for the pint of ice cream. Food is just so accessible and it’s so rewarding and it’s so kind of culturally driven and that that’s the first thing we automatically reach for. But when you choose not to do that, you then have to come up with all of the other ways to reward yourself and self soothe and, and kind of relieve anxiety. So you know, for me, what I find is most of the time we’re not actually craving the cookie, were missing some kind of connection or missing a connection to ourselves. We’re missing a connection with other people, maybe with our spirituality or with God or with this feeling of being centered or grounded, whatever it is. So generally I prefer to reach out when I’m having those difficult times or go inward and maybe I go to the gym or a yoga practice or I’d go on a solo hike. But restoring that connection and kind of sitting in the feeling and acknowledging the feeling and then processing it is what actually helps you move past it. You never find the answer in the bottom of a pint of ice cream.
You Never Marshall, we put that on profile. Never find the answer at the bottom of a half gallon of ice cream. Okay, so now you’re, you’re now known. I mean everybody knows you’re the, you’re the founder of the whole 30 program. However, I want to get into what originally inspired you to start this program?
Well, the look 30 started as a self experiment, so I was really into fitness at the time. I mean I am now still, but I was very much into crossfit. This was back in 2009. I was really focused on my athletic performance in recovery and we, you know, my original co founder and I, he had been doing all this research and just foods that perhaps we’re promoting inflammation and, and having negative effects in the body. And we were sitting around at a crossfit gym after a really tough Olympic lifting session and I recall very clearly that I was sitting on the floor eating a 10, like a tube of thin mints straight out of the box, the girl scout cookies because I had just exercise and I had earned it and he kind of said to me like, what if we did this really squeaky clean on a 30 day anti-inflammatory approach really, but cleaned it up completely, really strict for 30 days.
And I was like, yeah, that sounds good. Like I’m down for that, you know, when should we start? And he looked down at me and said, how about right now? And like mid. And then I just picked the box up, I handed them to my friend Zack and I said, okay, let’s do it. And those 30 days were so profoundly transformational for me, not only physically, but with respect to that emotional relationship with food and forcing me to change my habits and find those other ways to comfort and sell food that I decided to share about it on my training blog. And that was really back in 2009. The birth of the whole 30. It just started as a self experiment.
You look like you’re, you’re, you’re 21, maybe 24 months old, maybe 24. But uh, you been doing this for a long time. This is not an overnight success for you. This is something that you’ve built over time. And we have a lot of listeners out there who are business owners. We have about a half million downloads per month from people that are entrepreneurs. Very, very busy people, you know, plumbers, doctors, dentists, lawyers, and a lot of times people tell me as a business coach, they say I’m frustrated with my body and being out of shape, you know, and I’m not a fitness guy, so if you’re speaking to all the listeners out there who are very busy, they’re saying I’m so, I’m an attorney. I’m one of the top attorneys in my industry. Top lawyers, top plumber, tough people get out of shape and then they start to say, well, can you explain to us why the whole 30 program is perfect for somebody out there who’s a very busy entrepreneur?
Yes, it really is. Perfect. Here’s what I find. Again, our relationship with food is so foundational to everything else in our life in that if we feel like our food is on track, that we’re eating in a way that best suits us and we’re feeling good because of that and we’re paying attention to our diet and it’s serving us and we feel like we’re in control of our food. That spills over and has a positive impact every area of our life. But when we feel out of control with food, when we feel like we’re eating and we can’t stop eating and we don’t like the way our body looks, so it makes us even more that also still over into every area of our life. So you could focus on exercise, you could focus on meditation, you know, there are all these health approaches you could take, but a 30 day kind of self experiment, like the whole 30 I find goes so far into improving everything else. How you show up at work, how you show up at home, your self confidence, your mood, your attention span, your focus, your energy, your sleep, all of those things can be improved with a whole 30. And that benefits every area of your life, including your professional life.
I would not Marshall, I could not agree more. I’ve tried to agree more, but I could not agree more. This is. This is 100 percent agreement. Yeah. What? Oh three. Maybe most of your book, it starts with food came out in 2012, if I’m correct. Can you share with the listeners out there what this book was all about and why you think it’s become so a virally successful?
Yeah. It starts with food, with essentially it laid the groundwork for the foundation of the whole 30. This is where we talk about all of the science and all of our clinical experience that goes behind what we eliminate on the whole30 program and the food that we’re eating and if you are a question or if you’re a Gretchen Rubin Questioner, where in order to make habit change or in order to be accountable to yourself, you have to understand why you’re doing what you’re doing. It starts with food is really that missing piece. It walks you through all of the background, all of the protocol, all of the research, and it also provides some science behind why you feel out of control with food or why certain foods you know, react in your body in a different way than they react with your friends. So for a lot of people, this idea about their relationship with food and food in general, it’s very confusing. There’s a lot of information out there and understanding a little bit more of the science behind how food works in your brain and in your body and some of the background of the whole30 helps people feel like, oh, this makes total sense, and like I understand now why I’m going about this 30 day experiment. Exactly the way it’s outlined.
Melissa Hartwig, you might be such a big deal at this point. You might have thought to yourself, I don’t even remember being on the today show, but you’ve been on some huge shows. I mean you’ve been on Kelly’s show you’ve been on, you’ve been featured on some huge publication. You’ve talked at Google, you have been on live with Kelly and Ryan, you Marshall, she is sort of a big deal. You. Can you explain for the listeners before the massive success and before the whole30 program caught on, could you explain, I mean, did you grow up wealthy? I mean, what was, what was life like growing up?
I was pretty solid, like white middle class. I lived in New Hampshire growing up. My parents were married until I was in college. My mom stayed home to take care of us. We ate dinner together every night as a family. My mom was pretty health conscious in what was like health conscious for, you know, the 19 eighties. It was a really pretty. I was kind of a nerd. I read a lot of books. I was really smart. I didn’t play a lot of sports, like it was a pretty standard, pretty standard, you know, growing up. Yeah, pretty standard.
What was the interview you did? I don’t say this show don’t, don’t pandering because Marsha, we know that no one, no one really gets nervous for me. People who say I’m mentally intimidating him. Just by being able to speak eloquently. What’s a show you’ve been on where you thought to yourself, I cannot believe I’m on this show where you actually got nervous? Come on Melissa Hartwig hat was the show where you were asked to be on that you got nervous?
I don’t. I. I mean I don’t really get nervous for that kind of stuff. I know it sounds weird, but I don’t get nervous because for me, talking to one person in front of a live studio audience or a camera is no different than me standing up at a seminar and talking to 100 people at a crossfit gym and I’ve been doing it for so long. I mean the first time I was invited on Dr Oz was pretty intimidating but more because I really wanted to make sure that the integrity and the message of the whole30 came through and that the show didn’t try to spin it into some kind of weight loss that diet and they and they didn’t. They honored the message of the whole30 so incredibly well. They, they’ve done such a good job to help us share the word, but like that. I was concerned for that, but not necessarily nervous that I was gonna say the wrong thing.
Your, your success has been though exponential. Is there ever been a moment where you thought, this is crazy? Because I mean, there’s so many people. I had a lady at the conference come up to me, Marshall, and she goes, are you going to have Melissa Hartwig on this show? Almost nervous. Melissa Hartwig even say the words like, you don’t. I’m like, yes, yes we are. I mean, there was, I mean, seriously, it’s such a nervousness by even asking the question, have you ever. I mean, have you ever felt like, wow, I cannot believe how much success the whole 30 program has happened,
so all the time I think that I don’t think I ever imagined that the program would grow the way that it has, but you know, as I’ve said before, very, I very rarely take the opportunity to step back and take a look kind of big picture at what we’ve built here. You know, when you’re in it, when you’re running a business and doing the day to day and connecting with the community and thinking about how to serve them, you don’t really have many opportunities to say like, wow, look at how far we’ve come. Look at the impact we’re having in this area. So, you know, but once or twice a year usually at some kind of special event, I almost allow myself the opportunity to step back and look and I’m just so humbled and so grateful and so blown away at the impact that the program has had and that woman’s reaction really just speaks to the kinds of experiences people have on the whole 30, like it is so transformational and so life changing and they just are so excited to talk about it and share it with people and tell me their stories and it’s honestly the best part of my job is listening to them.
Let’s say that there was a person who called in on today’s show, right? And it’s just you and that person one on one and they say, I’ve struggled for years, you know, being 35 pounds overweight man or woman. Either way and no one else is recording this show. This is just me and you talking one on one. What, what, what, what, what does that kind of that direct candid feedback that you would give to somebody that you really cared about who has been trying every other fad diet, every other kind of, you know, and they’re just not getting the results. Give us that, that Kinda if that one on one, that candid, real raw feedback that somebody, a dear friend of yours, someone one on one would need to hear right now.
I think, you know, obviously there’s, that would be like a relationship. I would want to spend some time talking to them and understanding a bit about their history and why they’ve struggled and what they tried, but at the heart of that, I find the question that’s the most effective with people who say they’ve tried everything else and nothing has worked. The first question I’d ask is like, are they, are you always just doing diets and are you always focusing on weight loss? Because if you are, that’s literally the problem. You know, you’re never going to achieve the kind of radical health and life transformation with a calorically restricted weight loss diet. And if you haven’t considered it an approach like the whole30, which is almost like the anti diet where we’re focusing on health and habits and talking about your emotional relationship with food, that’s kind of the first place I would go, but I still have people who come to me who say I’ve done the whole30 a bunch of times or I’m interested in the whole30 but I could never do it because.
And the instinct is always to provide them with some logical answers for why they should or could do the program. Like, well we have a ton of resources or it’s really not that hard or we could help you, you know, stock your pantry. But the question I always kind of go to is what about the whole30 approach? Or what about changing your diet is so scary for you? Because there is some thing holding that person back. They want to make change. They’re not happy with what they’re doing, but there’s something holding them back and it’s not a logical argument. It is almost always an emotional argument. So stepping into that conversation a little differently and asking them, you know, what about this Cisos, Gary, what are you afraid of with making this change? At least unlocks and Avenue of conversation where you can actually dialogue and make a connection as opposed to just trading like excuses and logical answers to those excuses. You know,
I think some of our listeners, Marshall probably aren’t familiar with the whole30 program and they’re going to know I’m a business guy. I’m always focused on business. I know a lot about espn, know a lot about Fox, won a lot about CNN, don’t know a whole lot about a whole 30. Can you explain Melissa Hartwig, just kind of the size and the scope of the whole30 program, maybe the number of people you’ve been able to impact throughout the years. Just getting introduced to listeners to the size, the scope, the reins of the width of the program so that somebody out there can get a, a taste for how powerful this has been. How transformative this has been for many people.
Yeah. The whole30 has been around since 2009. So as you said, it’s not some kind of flash in the pan overnight success. We’ve been plugging away, changing people’s lives for almost 10 years now. There are seven whole30 books out now and publication all designed to support the program, but it’s very important for me to remind you that the entirety of the whole 30 is available for free on our website. So the program rules are free, whole 34 on a whole bunch of pdfs for support, things like shopping lists and meal planning template and label reading guides all free so you don’t have to buy anything but the food you’re eating to do the program. Um, the flagship whole30 book has been out since 2015 and is sold I think somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 million copies in North America. So, you know, that’s like literally millions of people who have been changing their lives. And at this point I feel like will 30th almost a household name? We’ve got whole30 approved products in Walmart, applegate as an approved partner. Lacroix is a partner, is that we’ve kitchen has a whole30 approved menu and we’re about to roll out some additional kind of big partnerships for January. Blue Apron has run whole 30 menus, so at this point it’s, you know, pretty ubiquitous in our culture in terms of like the grocery stores, the mail delivery, the restaurants, and just in culture. I love hearing it pop up in pop culture references.
You don’t want to ask bullets. I want to target this, right. Well we will put this on the show notes for listeners who want to get all the free tools, can you share with the listeners out there the website where they can go right now to get all these free tools. I know a lot of people are gonna want to go there right now?
Yeah, everything is just whole30, so w, h o, l e and the number 30. If you go to our website, [inaudible] dot com, there’s a little button that says I knew and if you click on that button and it walks you through everything you need to kind of learn more about the program and begin and then all of our social media, we have like a really huge thriving, welcoming, positive community on social media and all of those handles are also just add whole30.
Okay. Marcy got on the show notes. I got it. Okay, great. Now Melissa, um, you’re a very purposeful person. I know is your, is your career has taken off, you know, you’re going to get approached for that. I really no talent. People like myself, Marshall, no talent, people with myself with no talent. People reaching out to you for podcast interviews, people reaching out for questions. People saying, hey, I want to connect with you, want to meet with you for lunch. Can you please explain how you’ve been able to stay sane and how you plan out those first four hours of your typical day?
Yes. I am quite famous in my community, at least from my commitment to my morning routine like capital and capital are. I do not deviate from it for basically any reason. Even when I travel, even when I’m on vacation in the morning routine is preserved and I figured this out a long time ago. Realizing that as an entrepreneur working for myself, if I didn’t start the day off the way that I intended it, my day was just going to run me over, so I wake up in the morning almost at the basically at the same time every day around 6:30 without alarm. If I have my son that week, I’m kind of hanging out, doing breakfast, playing with him for the first hour and a half of our day. Otherwise I go straight to the gym either way. The very first thing I do in the morning as I go to the gym for a healthy movement session or I’ll go to a yoga class or I’ll go on a hike, so it is. I’m not looking at my phone. I’m not checking email. I’m not on social media. I’m not on phone calls. I don’t do any of that until I get about like 90 minutes of healthy movement in, on the way home. I listened to a really fun playlist and just have some good music on. I come home and make breakfast, drink, uh, decaf coffee and then about 10:00 every morning that’s when I start my work day.
A routine for you, for your ritualistic. You do the same thing everyday.
Every day I, I kinda, I schedule like when I go on vacation I book my hotels around where there is a really baller gym so that I can wake up in morning routine and an environment that I find like really warm and welcoming. So like none of these cramped hotel gym. I will find a hotel that has a really nice gym and I’ll make sure, you know, there are some days where I can’t do this because I have really early morning media or an early morning flight, but more days than not. Even on a book tour, I am sticking to this morning routine.
What is, what is a good. You probably just shared five things you do every day that no one else does. You become successful as a result of doing things a certain way. Is there one thing that you do every day that most people don’t do that you think has allowed you to achieve? Success? Is is your routine? Is it your somebody out there going, I just. Oh, Mozart with. I want to be like her someday.
I will, yeah. I’ll tell you one thing I do. I don’t know that most people don’t do it, but it’s one thing and it’s like maybe a little unexpected, but it has to do with my evening routine because I feel like what you do at night is just as important. If I can book in by beginning of my day and end up my day with routines, it lets me feel like I can be a lot more flexible and spontaneous. I make time to read every single night, so before I go to bed I have a book, whether it’s fiction or nonfiction, but I read a lot of fiction and like every single day. Usually towards the end of my day, either right after I put my son to bed or right before I go to sleep, I’m reading my book and that takes the place of scrolling through instagram mindlessly or watching another episode of tv or you know, just doing stuff on my computer that I shouldn’t be doing, but I also think it really helps me unwind from my day. I don’t read books at night. They’re always either nonfiction for pleasure or just fiction, but it just helps me like call my brain down, give me a little something to focus on that isn’t a screen and I really think that that’s made a huge difference in me maintaining my creativity, maintaining focus and productivity during the day, but it also just makes me happy.
Melissa, are there a couple of books you think every entrepreneur should read out there? Every entrepreneur you said, you know what? This book this year really, really impacted me and I think everybody should read this book.
Okay. I have a few. It’s really hard to recommend books for everyone, but I’ll say a couple of shoe dog by Phil Knight. The story of Phil Knight and has like building Nike was an amazing story and really, really well written, but what helped me realize, you assume that big companies like Nike, they have it all figured out from the start that they are like a well oiled machine from day one and watching what was just a hot mess for so many years.
Developed and like figured it out
seven years. That’s called a blue ribbon sports or something. It was seven years ago. I was just in the wilderness. That is, that is profound.
It was really comforting actually for me because it made me look at what I was doing and think like, okay, it’s cool that you don’t have it altogether because like neither did nike, so that was really helpful. There’s another book too called rework on that. It’s kind of like my Bible for building my business. Jason Fried and David, he’s got two last names. Heinemeier Hansson I think it was, but anyway, basically talks about, you know, you don’t, when you’re building a business you almost feel like you are pushed into this culture of like it always has to be more and it always has to be more corporate and you have to do things the way that these big companies do it and rework Kinda like takes all of that crumpled in a ball and says nope, you can do it any way you want. You can stay small, you can say lean, you can say nimble, you don’t have to have monthly meetings, you don’t have to have a rigid org chart. And I really found a lot of freedom in that approach too when I was building whole 30.
Well this is my final question for you is over the next 12 months I know sometimes you don’t want to share a certain goals of everybody you know, but people were so curious about you and what you’re doing with whole 30 over the next 12 months. What are, what are a couple of projects that you’re excited about or what should people expect to see from you? And the whole 30 program.
Well the first thing is that I’m starting a podcast, which is very exciting and I was so impressed when you guys reached out to me. Your podcast page is probably the most beautiful I’ve ever seen on your website. I really loved how well done everything is done so I’m definitely taking inspiration from you, but you know, I really want to share some of these learnings and findings and like more than just the whole 30. I want to talk about entrepreneuring and self care and addiction recovery and like all of these other areas in which I’m really passionate and outspoken. So I think a podcast is on my calendar for maybe first quarter of next year and I’m really excited about that. Uh, and then I, you know, we have one more book coming out that I can’t talk about just yet, but it’s another whole 30 book to help people stay successful with the program. Um, you know, other than that I really am just tapping into the community to stay in touch with what they want to be successful and try to provide them with any new resources that they may request.
Well, Melissa, hopefully you can sense the sincerity of what we’re all about. We was, we just want to help mentor millions in so many people ask us questions about health and fitness and martial. I look at each other like, oh, we don’t know when we built the, we built 13 multimillion dollar companies, my partner and I and, and, but we’re not, you know, the fitness guy. So thank you so much for getting into a different lane here and to talk into an army of entrepreneurs. It means the world to us.
Yeah, it’s my pleasure. Now I know where to send all of my, you know, healthy fit people who want to grow better businesses. So I think it works well both ways.
Well, I hope you have a blessed rest of your night and thank you for allowing us to interrogate you and everybody out there. If you’ve not been a whole thirty.com, go to [inaudible] dot com and buy anything that Melissa will sell you, but ruby reminded everything is available for free if you, if you want to get it for the low, low price of free 99. Again, Melissa, thank you so much for being on the show.
Thank you both so much. This was wonderful to chat with you.
Take care. Oh, Jason, can you believe the caliber of guests that we continue to have on the thrive time show? I honestly cannot like it blows my mind. I have a question for you. Yes sir. Um, you did kind of a health transformation in the past two years as it looks, it seems like. Yeah. What, what, what, what, what have you been doing? What’s been your approach to the last, the last two years to your health transformation? I’m meal prepping, like knowing what you’re going to eat the next day is huge. If you just go, you know, fly by the seat of your pants and you don’t prepare, then the next thing you’re doing is stopping at a drive through and grabbing some super carb heavy meal that’s just going to weigh you down. So how much weight have you lost in the past? Let’s say two years and the past two years I’ve stayed within the one 70 range and that’s been with minimal exercise just because I’m not eating garbage anymore.
Okay. How much weight did you lose total roughly? Twenty to 25 pounds. Okay. So you lost 20 to 25 pounds. What does your typical day meal look like? What are you, what do we eat on a typical day? What does that. What does that meal plan look like? Lots of water, lots of water. Water is super important. A lot of people don’t realize that because it helps keep you full, but then also keeps you hydrated. I’ll take notes here. I’m going to eat a lot of water. I also make sure that I get enough protein and fiber and nutrients. I take a multivitamin every day. Fish oil, just so I can make sure that if I’m missing something in my diet, my body’s still getting what it’s lacking. So what did you eat yesterday? What was a typical day for you? What do you eat?
Just give us. Give us the male. What’d you eat all day? Yesterday I had coffee. Always have coffee at least four to eight times a day. Trek. A lot of coffee and water. What else did you drink? A gallon of water. Made sure that I hit my gallon mark for uh, yesterday morning in I had an egg wrap for breakfast and then for lunch I had a mix of just different nuts and that plus the water kept me going until the evening where I had veggies and rice and Tofu. Okay. Well I’ll, I’ll tell you what, if you’re out there, thrive nation, you’re saying, look, I am looking for the perfect equation to get my body in great shape this year. It’s a new year. I’m ready to go. I want to eat a sustainable diet that works. Check out the book whole 30 your 30 day guide to total health and food freedom.
Over 2 million people have already purchased the book and Melissa Hartwig is a is super sincere powerhouse of personal health. She wants you to achieve success with your health and your fitness and we do to check it out today. Whole 30 is the name of the book. Whole 30 is the name of the book, the Thirty Day guide to total health and food freedom, and we like to end each and every show with a boom, but not before. I pester you about taking actions because we all know that vision without execution, according to Thomas Edison, is a hallucination. Again, vision without execution is hallucination. So if you watch every ted talks video ever download every thrive time show podcast, but you don’t take action, then it’s nothing’s going to change. So I asked you today, what are the action steps that you’re going to take? I would recommend for you, I’ve seen so many members of the thrive nation do this. I would recommend that you eliminate wheat, eliminate sweets from your, from your diet, and good things happen when you eliminate wheat and the sweets. And now that any further I do three, two, one, boom.
One more thing. If you have yet to share this podcast with a friend, I would love it if you would do it today. There are so many people all around the world, millions of people who’ve been helped out as a result of the thrive time show. But the other day when I interviewed Clayton Christiansen, the, uh, head of the Harvard Business School, uh, he had never heard of the thrive time show podcast before. And that’s gotTa stop, thrive nation. We’ve got an epidemic out there. There are people that don’t know about the thrive time show. So think about who you could share it with today. Uh, maybe be a complete homer, Sela, that’d be awesome. I’m not asking Jason, I’m not going to ask for all the listeners to send out a mass text with a link to the thrive time show to everyone in their phone, right? I’m not going to even hint about that. I mean, I’m not going to, with all due respect, I’m not even going to even, uh, you know, flirt with the idea of you sharing this podcast with everyone in your phone. Uh, but other people have suggested that maybe that’d be a great idea. Right, right. But you’re not. No, I would, I would never do that.