Branding | Branding 101 Taught By the Public Relations Consultant of Choice for Pizza Hut, Nike, Prince, George Carlin + “The search engine definitely helped. It doesn’t matter how good you are if you aren’t getting enough leads.” – Ryan Wimpey

Show Notes

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Audio Transcription

Yes, yes, yes, and yes! Thrive Nation on today’s show, we are doing a show about how to improve your branding. So if you’re out there today trying to generate more leads to sell more stuff to your ideal and likely buyers, today’s show is the show for you. So grab a pen and a pad and prepare to enter into the lab in the dojo of Mojo Fo’s show. It’s the Thrive Time Show on your radio and podcast download. Here we go. Some shows don’t need a celebrity narrator to introduce the show. But this show does. In a world filled with endless opportunities, why would two men who have built 13 multi-million dollar businesses altruistically invest five hours per day to teach you the best practice business systems and moves that you can use? Because they believe in you, and they have a lot of time on their hands. They started from the bottom, now they’re here. It’s the Thrive Time Show, starring the former U.S. Small Business Administration’s Entrepreneur of the Year, Clay Clark, and the entrepreneur trapped inside an optometrist’s body, Dr. Robert Zolnick. Two men, eight kids, co-created by two different women, 13 multi-million dollar businesses. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom and we’ll show you how to get here. Started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom and now we’re at the top, teaching you the systems to get what we got? Colton Dixon’s on the hooks. I break down the books. See, it’s bringing some wisdom and the good looks. As a father of five, that’s why I’m alive. So if you see my wife and kids, please tell them hi. It’s the C and T upon your radio. And now, three, two, one, here we go. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, and we’ll show you how to get there. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. All right, Amelia, on today’s show, we’re talking about the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power of the power Alright, Amelia, on today’s show we’re talking about specifically branding. Now branding is such an important thing for business owners. A, because by default most people don’t think about branding. B, because it impacts everything. C, because people do judge a book by its cover. People do judge people based upon their first impression. So I’m gonna go through a checklist with you of all the things we need to do for every single client that we work with as it relates to branding. And if you have any thoughts, pontifications, reactions, and or questions, you let me know. Does that sound fair? Yes, will do. Okay, so here we go. First off, you have to be, you must be intentional about the following areas of your business. Okay? And if you’re not intentional, it’s going to get weird real quickly. Okay? So one, the sights. Okay? Two, the sounds. Three, the smells. What? Sights, sounds, smells. The experiences slash customer interactions. You want to be very intentional about the packaging. You know, when you give somebody the packaging or maybe you buy something from the store and they put it in a bag. So it’s the packaging, it’s the bagging, maybe you call that the presentation. But you have to be very intentional about the sights, sounds, smells, experiences, customer interactions and that packaging or bagging or the presentation. Why when you as a woman, when you go into a store, let’s say you go into a retail store, you go into a nice store, Utica Square, whatever, why is it important that the sites in that retail store are on point? Because that’s what draws your attention. It’s like a first impression. So think in your mind, when was the last time that you went into a business, and I’m not looking for the business’s name, but the last time you went into a business and you thought yourself, wow, this is some really, really terrible smells we’ve discovered here. When was the last time that you went into a business and you’re like, what is going on? Has that ever happened to you? Yeah, yeah, that happens. And what is your reaction? Do you want to stay there more? Did you leave? What happens? No, it makes you want to find somewhere else to be, to go somewhere else. And do you as a customer to go and tell the actual store owner and say, hey, by the way, before I leave, I just thought you should know because I want to be a nice woman, I want to be a nice person, I think it’s good for your business’s benefit, I think that we should fix the smell. Do you ever have those thoughts? Personally, no, I’ve never. So what would you do if you went into a business and it smelled horrible, how long would you stay there? How often would you come back? Approximately three minutes. Probably never. You would never come back? Probably not. If it smelled really foul? Really bad, probably not. Why? Because I can find somewhere else that doesn’t smell bad. There you go. And so I find it mind-boggling when you hire people and they say no one ever complained about the smell Well, yeah, cuz they’re the customer So you have to have the mindset. I’m gonna give you a notable quotable. This comes from the founder of Intel the microchip people he says only the paranoid survive only the paranoid only the paranoid Survive only the paranoid survive who said that Andy Grove the founder of Intel, okay This is a guy who escaped communism to live for a free world. I can live in a free world He escaped communism, but he’s only the paranoid survive This is so critical You have to understand only the paranoid survive. Okay. Let me give you a notable quotable from Michael Levine This is the PR consultants He worked on the public relations the image the branding for Pizza Hut Nike perhaps you’ve heard of them, Michael Jackson, Prince, etc. He says, and by the way, he will be at our next in-person two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshop. He will be there. So the Tiffany Theory states that a gift delivered in a box from Tiffany’s will have a higher perceived value than one in no box or a plain box. That’s not because the recipient is a fool, it’s because in our society we gift wrap everything. Our politicians, our corporate heads, our movie and TV stars, and even our toilet paper. Public relations is like gift wrapping. What do you get your reaction to that quote? Oh, that’s so true. I mean, it’s just like a, I was listening to your podcast from a while back about the wedding ring, expensive wedding ring in a Kmart box versus the cheap ring in a Tiffany box. It’s just how it is. And so on part two of today’s show, I’m going to introduce everybody to a long-time client of business we helped grow dramatically called Tip Top K9. We helped them to grow from one location, we helped them triple their revenue, and then open up well over a dozen locations. It’s a fabulous story, and we’re going to hear about it on part two of today’s show. But again, you’ve got to have the sights, the branding, the presentation, the employee uniforms, employee, come on out folks, employee uniforms, okay? Your menus, okay? Your, you can call this the business cards. We could call this the TV screens, all right? All of these things, think about your business folks, think about your business. Everything that a customer sees and touches has to be on point, it has to be. Sights, sounds, smells, so let’s talk about it. The sights, when you come into the elephant in the room where you’re a manager at the men’s grooming lounge, it’s supposed to look clean. Yes. And when people walk in, they make a first impression right away. Absolutely. So when people walk into this office, we have an interview we’re gonna do here at 5.30 tonight. People walk in, there are people that walk in and they go, oh, this is awesome. They always say, I didn’t know anything like this existed, or this is great, or whatever. Other people go, I’m leaving. And it’s because I am unapologetically pro-Christian and pro-America. And so that shows up in my decor. But you gotta have intentional sight. So in the elephant in the room, it’s a modern, rustic decor atmosphere. The sounds, we have a playlist, Elephant in the Room of Music, designed to create an up-tempo environment. You’ve got to be intentional about the sounds. Now this includes on-hold music. Folks, hopefully I’m helping somebody out. This is the on-hold music. What? On-hold music, okay? This is the overhead music for your business. This is anything that the customer sees, smells, the sounds they experience. You’ve gotta be intentional about the smells. It’s supposed to smell like peppermint and the elephant in the room stores. Now this just in. If you hire people that smell bad, they won’t know when things smell bad. Why? Because they smell bad. Right! These are the things that you have to think about. Okay, next. Experiences and customer interactions. Think about your restaurant. How do you want people to be greeted? Underneath this idea, we could say call scripts are so important. That’s how you, that’s the customer interaction, call scripts. And by the way, if you’re going to install call scripts, you want to use the call recording system, okay? The call recording system from That’s who I recommend. You can use whoever you want, but I recommend You got to have call scripts. You need to have greeting scripts. You need to have, everything needs to be scripted out. So important. Packaging, bagging, you know this, I know this, but people go to the Apple store and they keep the Apple box. Why do people keep the packaging from Apple? Because it’s so pretty. They do keep it, don’t they? Yeah, I still have my iPad box from three years ago. And people keep, and I’m just giving you an example of stores. If you go into Limited, you go into Panera Bread, you go to Starbucks, insert the name of the brand that you like. They’re very intentional about their packaging. It’s so important that the packaging is consistent. Think about the brands that you like, folks. They’re all intentional about the packaging. Think about In-N-Out Burger, In-N-Out Burger. They have, at In-N-Out Burger, they actually put Bible verses on the bottom of all the cups. They put Bible verses on all of the packaging. Why do they do it? It’s because the owner of the company was once a communist and he actually went after he left communism and became a Christian He recognized that wow, this was a life-changing thing for him And he didn’t want the company to ever forget the values of the pro-christian message that changed his life So he put it on everything. The packaging, the branding, it’s so intentional. Uniforms. Why do you have to have uniforms? So everybody, you know, looks the same. You upkeep the culture. Now you’ve seen this at Elephant in the Room before. If you don’t tell the men and women that work there what to wear, what do they do all the time? I mean, at least once a week. They break chest code. Right. Leggings, crop tops, sweatshirts, hoodies. It just gets gross over time, doesn’t it? Disgusting. You have to bring it up over and over and over. Now next you have menus. These are printed menus, you know, so if you’re a restaurant or a business, you want to think about your printed menus. You might want to think about your digital menus. You want to think about your digital menus, business cards, TV screens, one sheets, anything Anything that the customer sees, office decor, lobby decor, the office decor, the bathroom decor, I mean, just think about anything that a customer sees, you have to be intentional about these things. Now, once you have these things, you need to make a checklist for everything, okay? You must create an intentional checklist about everything in your business that matters. You must create an intentional checklist about the following areas of your business. Again, sights, sounds, smells, experiences, call scripts, greeting scripts, packaging, bagging, presentation. You think about employee uniforms, printed menus, digital menus, business cards, TV screens, one sheets, office decor, lobby decor, the hobby or the bathroom decor. You just want to think about does your business feel like a hobby lobby or does your business feel like a homeless shelter? Does your business feel like a quick trip or does it feel like a bus station? Does your business feel like a brand that you love or does it feel like a lot of people go to Starbucks just to hang out. A lot of people go to certain coffee shops just to hang out. You want to create an environment that makes people want to come back and back and they don’t know why. That’s what you want to do. Make sense? Yes. All right. So now the next is the next notable quotable. Steve Jobs says simplicity scales and complexity fails. This was the co-founder of Apple, the man who invented, he introduced the iPhone to the world. The man who invented the iPhone, the iPod, the iPad, iTunes. You get the idea. He revolutionized many industries. Why do you have to have a checklist for everything we just talked about? To make sure everything gets done and it gets done repeatedly. It’s so important that you do that. It’s absolutely so important. You also need to focus on your online reputation, okay? And underneath your online reputation, you want to get video reviews and Google reviews and third-party industry reviews. So think, an example would be like WebMD. So if anybody is looking for a doctor, most people that are looking for a doctor, they look up the doctor’s name and they read the WMD reviews, the WebMD reviews. Most people that look up a company, they read the Google reviews. Most people read the video reviews. Why is that so important? People care what other people have to say about their past experiences with a company or a doctor or so on. What happens if you don’t, if you’re not intentional? What’s going to happen to your business if you’re not intentional? Things are going to drift. What do you mean? If you’re not intentional about getting good, objective, honest reviews from clients that have had a good experience with you, then people aren’t gonna know about your company, they’re not gonna know what good services you have, and eventually they’re gonna find somebody else to go with. And I’ll give you an example of an example by default. You know, we have, or one of our businesses is called Elephant in the Room, and we have, it’s a men’s grooming lounge, it’s a haircut chain. And we legitimately had a long-time customer, a great guy, he reached out to us, he said, hey, I’m moving, I’d like to cancel my membership, it makes sense. So the employee tells me they canceled their membership, which makes sense. And the employee, the customer said they kept getting charged. So the customer called us today and said, hey, I’ve been consistently charged for the last six months, and I need to get that refunded. That makes sense. And the customer asked for a refund, we’re going to refund them. But most people don’t act like that nice, courteous client did. Most people don’t have that attitude of generosity and kindness. That guy reached out, we solved the problem. But most people just, they leave a scathing review online, and then they might call and ask for a refund. But they usually leave the scathing review first. So you’ve absolutely got to be obsessed with the branding of your business. Branding is what shapes the perception of the products and services that you’re selling. It makes people determine what in their mind they’re going to pay for something. Let me give you another example. We all know of very pretty women, we all know of very handsome men that are horrible at every aspect of their life except for hitting the gym. They’re really disciplined and diligent with the gym and that’s great. People treat them differently, they treat them differently, they put them on a pedestal, they give them favoritism because they are an attractive person. We also know people that are really, really smart, really hard working, but they’re overlooked. We also know people who pay a lot of money for a t-shirt that’s made by a name brand. We know people that buy very expensive shoes because of the name brand. We know people that are willing to pay more for a specific kind of alcohol because of the name brand. shape the mindset of your ideal and likely buyer. So before they even get to you, they’re formulating an opinion based upon that which they can see, smell, touch, feel, experience. So hopefully I’m being very clear here. If you don’t have your branding in place, your whole business is gonna be jacked up, okay? So on part two of today’s show, I’m gonna introduce you to Michael Levine. Now, Michael Levine is going to share the rest of the story, and Michael Levine, again, is the PR consultant of choice for Pizza Hut, for Nike, for Prince, for Michael Jackson’s estate. Even today, he works on Michael Jackson’s estate. This is a guy who worked with George Carlin. He’s worked with… I don’t want to get it wrong, because I always get it wrong by default, so let me just look this up real quick here, so we’re on the same page. This is on his Wikipedia page. I’m not saying that Wikipedia is always right about everything, but I’m doing a search for public relations Michael Levine. And this is Wikipedia reporting. He’s represented 43 New York Times bestselling authors and 34 Grammy Award winners. So this guy has provided commentary for Variety, Forbes, Fox News, New York Times. He’s considered the Michael Jordan of PR. Do you want to know how much money I had to pay the guy the first time I met him? I want you to tell me. I had to pay him $25,000 for him to teach me public relations over a two-day period of time. So I paid him a total of $25,000 for eight hours of his time. Wow. Yeah, because I wanted to learn public relations from the guy who literally wrote the book on PR. This is the world’s most successful public relations person in the history of America. This is the guy, and his name is Michael Levine, and he wrote a book called PR 2.0, which is a fabulous book for anybody who wants to know public relations and how it all works. It really is a powerful book, and I encourage everybody, if you haven’t read the book, you should read the book because public relations shapes everything. And it really does determine who we’re going to vote for in elections. It determines what food we get, what clothes we wear. And again, his book is called Gorilla PR 2.0, How to Wage an Effective Publicity Campaign Without Going Broke. Gorilla PR 2.0, How to Wage an Effective Publicity Campaign Without Going Broke. know, wage an effective, how to wage an effective publicity campaign without going broke. I’ll put a link to it on the show notes. But again, if somebody, if we’re working with a client here, Amelia, and you’re a coach and you don’t bring up to them that their website looks terrible and you don’t bring up to them that their business cards don’t look great and you don’t bring up to them that their smells are bad, you don’t bring up to them that they need a uniform. What’s going to happen to their business over time? It’s going to go downhill. Their clients are going to notice these things and like you said, not say anything, let it go and then eventually it’s just going to not be great. Why won’t a client say anything? They’ll go somewhere else. They don’t. Okay, let’s take that out. Let’s take that out even further here. Why doesn’t the wife of the owner say anything? Why doesn’t the owner say anything himself? Why don’t people say anything? Why do people just let it go? Why as a culture do we not say anything? I’ll tell you why. It’s because as a culture, we have been told or have been taught or have learned we don’t want to upset people. Confrontation is bad. Right. So we don’t want to have confrontation. So we don’t want… So when we’re working with a client, I mean, this is step five of the process of growing a business, but this is so incredibly important. And so I encourage everybody out there, you want to rate yourself on a scale of one to 10. Okay. So you want to rate everybody out there, homework for you, on a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being the highest, on the following areas. This is so important that you do this, because if you don’t do this right now, you’re probably not going to come back to it. You’re probably going to have a bad by default. Bad by default is probably what’s going to happen. Let me give you an example. You know, years ago I worked with a cosmetic, it was a skin care business. It’s a, so you go there if you have skin problems, okay? So it’s a business that helps you with your epidermis, right? It’s a skin care company. And I asked them, I said, could you rate yourself on a scale of one to 10 in these following areas? And we go through and they, the owner says, oh my gosh, we don’t even have on hold music. And I said, that’s fair, that’s fine. He says, oh my gosh, we don’t even have a website that looks good. And I said, oh, okay. He says, oh my gosh, we don’t even have an intentional smell. Oh, no, we don’t even have a plan for how we greet people. We don’t even have a script for the calls. We don’t even have a call recording. We don’t even have uniforms. We don’t even have digital menus. We don’t have business cards. We don’t have one sheets. We don’t have office decor. We don’t have lobby decor. We don’t have the bathroom decor. We don’t have any online reputation. We don’t have video reviews. We don’t have Google reviews. We don’t have auto wraps. We just don’t do, we don’t have it.” And I said, no problem. And so I worked with this guy. I flew down to Texas to work with his business. And what we did, these are the true story, this is what we did. We decided to serve, because he’s, again, he does skin care. He’s a doctor. He’s working with your epidermis. This is what he does. And so as a skin care doctor, he’s meeting with typically moms and their daughter, who’s like a teenager or their son, and they’ve got outrageous acne or some kind of acne, and they’re trying to deal with it. And so they’re in the lobby, the appointment’s booked at four, but usually the doctors are running a little bit late. You know, you go visit a dermatologist and the doctor may be running a little late. And so I said, why don’t you have that local version of like a Panera bread, drop off fresh fruit and coffee throughout the day. So you can do it in the morning, afternoon. So people are waiting in your lobby, they get a chance to really enjoy some great food while they’re waiting. And he says, yeah, let’s do it. I mean, what would that cost? We checked in and do it. It was like a hundred bucks a day. And I said, now with your office, man, you’ve got this exposed brick wall over here that looks, if you do high contrast, it’ll make sense. So let’s paint the wall over here with your brand colors. And then let’s keep the exposed brick over here. Let’s paint the ceilings black so people forget that they’re up there, because it wasn’t a really good look. Let’s replace the fluorescent light bulbs with incandescent bulbs. Let’s put print pieces up in the bathroom, in the lobby, that convey confidence, that explain what you do. Let’s have the print pieces make sense. Let’s have the greeter have a script that she uses to greet people. Let’s install call recording. Let’s get the recorded music. Let’s record the calls for quality assurance. Let’s have on hold music. Let’s have TV menu boards that tell people about the services you provide. Let’s start getting Google reviews. Let’s start getting video reviews. True story. Well, I get a call from him. It took about eight weeks to implement all this. So during our weekly call, he says, Clay, it’s the craziest thing. People are no longer complaining about the wait in my lobby. And I go, yeah, because they like the food. He says, it’s unbelievable, like my, our number of, we get a certain number of website leads or people that reach out, but our conversion rate is significantly higher. And I said, yeah, because the person who’s answering the phone knows the calls are recorded. And he says, it’s like everything is working, we’re getting more leads. I said, yeah, because you’re getting Google reviews and video reviews. He says, you know, I just, it’s the whole thing is working. Now that’s only one fourteenth of the entire system that we create, but you’ve got to nail down the branding. If you don’t nail down the branding, again, what’s going to happen by default there, Miss Amelia? You’ve just got to be intentional about this stuff because consumers care about branding. They like it or not, they do. Now I paid, again, $25,000 to meet Michael Levine for eight hours. So I’m going to play for you about $3,000 worth of training from the world’s number one PR guy who will be speaking at our June in-person two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshop. So folks, I encourage everyone to grab a pen and a pad and prepare to enter into the dojo of Mojo Faux Show. Then on part three of today’s show, if you can believe it, we’re going to feature a special celebration of a long-time client, Tip Top K9, who had dramatic growth. It is going to be a great show. Folks, I encourage you to take notes and get yourself psychologically prepared for today’s edition of the Thrive Time Show on your radio and podcast download as we do a deep dive. It, 1980, was the year of my conception. From the dorm room found a DJ connection. Entrepreneur over here in 07. On my path to the top, I’ve learned a lot of lessons Kicked out of college, writing a parody rap A dissed O.R.U., like a trumpet blows, you recap I’ve been known for getting stuff done, like giving a crap Infant jock and a win, so where my competition at? Now it is a thrive time show, on your radio Catch the broadcast, or the pockets download If you’ve got a business, we’ll help it grow God’s got a plan you just didn’t yet know About workflows, systems, scripts and hiring He’s motivating yourself when you need inspiring He’s facing me for radio and not TV Talking everything from clay to Z Automatically bangs haircuts, get glasses You want to stuff your body, so it’s with the masses No classes or pre-requisites Just business school as raw as it gets It’s a thrive time show on the radio Yes it is Oh, yeah It’s all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about you, all about Hello, my name is Michael Levine. In the last 35 years, I’ve represented 58 Academy Award winners, 34 Grammy Award winners, and 43 New York Times bestsellers. I’ve owned a PR firm for, as I said, 35 years and represented some of the most famous people of our time. For the last two years, I have come to Clay Clark’s Thrive Alive seminar in December. And I must say, I didn’t know what to expect at first, but it’s exceptional, filled, brimming enthused, inquisitive entrepreneurs doing extraordinary things. So much of the year I spend in a disappointed feelings about things I see in our society and in our culture, but coming here wipes that all clean. I mean really serious about your career, your entrepreneurship, your wealth creation ability. I strongly, strongly implore you to come to Tulsa, invest the two days. It will change your life. It’s quite extraordinary and I’m a tough grader, so thank you. My name is Michael Levine. Some shows don’t need a celebrity narrator to introduce the show. But this show does. In a world filled with endless opportunities, why would two men who have built 13 multi-million dollar businesses altruistically invest five hours per day to teach you the best practice business systems and moves that you can use? Because they believe in you. And they have a lot of time on their hands. This started from the bottom, now they’re here. It’s the Thrive Time Show, starring the former U.S. Small Business Administration’s Entrepreneur of the Year, Clay Clark, and the entrepreneur trapped inside an optometrist’s body, Dr. Robert Zilmer. Two men, eight kids, co-created by 2 different women. 13 multi-million dollar businesses. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom and we’ll show you how to get here. Started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We took flight, started from the bottom, and now we’re at the top. Teaching you the systems to hear what we got. Colton Dixon’s on the hoops, I break down the books. She’s bringing some wisdom and the good looks As the father of five, that’s why I’m alive So if you see my wife and kids, please tell them hi It’s the C and T up on your radio And now 3, 2, 1, here we go! We started from the bottom, now we’re here We started from the bottom and we’ll show you how to get here We started from the bottom, now we’re here We started from the bottom, now we’re here We started from the bottom, now we’re here Yes, yes, yes, and yes! Thrive Nation on today’s show, we’re talking about branding and branding 101 with Michael Levine, the PR consultant of choice for Nike, Pizza Hut, George Carlin, Nancy Kerrigan, Michael Jackson, Prince, everybody. And he talks about branding. I’m quoting here says if you give someone a present and you give it to them in a Tiffany box It’s likely that they’ll believe the gift has higher perceived value Then if you gave it to them and no box or a box of less prestige That’s not because the receiver of the gift is a fool but instead because we live in a culture in which we gift-wrap everything our everything, our politicians, our corporate heads, our movie and TV stars, and even our toilet paper. Public relations is like gift wrapping. Michael Levine says the PR consultant of choice for Nike, Pizza Hut, George Carlin, Nancy Kerrigan, Michael Jackson, Prince, everybody. And again, on part two of today’s show, he’s going to join us to talk about public relations and why advertising is what you pay for, but public relations is what you pay for. He’ll talk about that on part two of today’s show, but JT Lawson joins us from He is Tulsa’s highest rated and most reviewed dog trainer. And JT Lawson, welcome on to the Thrived Time Show. How are you, sir? I’m doing great. Thank you, sir. So I’ve got to ask you this about branding real quick here. When people go to, I want all the listeners to go there right now so you can check it out, No matter where you’re listening from, go to When they go to the website, there’s this thing called hieratic scaling. Hieratic scaling, it’s a journalistic term, but you put the most important stuff first and as you work down the website, you’re going to add in details that are maybe less important. So, hieratic scaling, it would be like a headline. So, if you read a headline, you go to Fox News, go to CNN, go to whatever. The most important thing is first, then the second thing is maybe less important, the third is less important, et cetera. So, I’ll do an example here. This is audio only, but I encourage everyone to look this up here, okay? So, we’re gonna type in Ryan Tedder sells music catalog. I went to college with Ryan Tedder and he happens to be a phenomenal musician. And the article that comes up here from the Sydney Morning Herald says, Ryan Tedder sells his song catalog for $276 million. It says, now he’s intent on making more. And that’s the headline. Then underneath it, the less important, it’s still very important, but not as important as the headline, it says, with Beyonce’s Halo, Leona Lewis’ Bleeding Love, Adele’s Rumor Has It, and his own band, One Republic’s Too Late to Apologize, among his credits, few songwriters have for better or worse, depending upon your taste for dramatic ballads, dominated modern pop music as Ryan Tedder. And it goes on and on, listing all the songs. He’s written songs for U2. He’s written songs for basically insert the name of whatever big artist you’re talking about. Adele, he’s written for them. But you put the big, the main thing first. So let’s go back to the website. And we look at the website and JT, the first thing I see here, and again, maybe you disagree, but the first thing I see right now, the most important thing is your first lesson is always always just 50 cents and will be any competitor’s price. To me, that seems like the most important thing. Is that the most important thing in the eyes of the consumers that are looking for Tulsa Dog Training? Yeah, I think so. I think also another important thing is a money back guarantee. So that’s super important because then they know that the training will work or they get their money back. So it’s like a why not where a lot of these trainers just use terminology, it might stick and you don’t really know what you’re getting. So, again, you look at the top of the website, hopefully everybody out there is doing this. If you have a website, folks, do this. Go to, look at it. Just go to type in to your browser Use this as an example. You go there. The most important thing is that your first lesson is always just 50 cents and will be any competitor’s price. That’s like the most important thing first. Boom. Think first, boom. Then you scroll down and it says, schedule your first lesson for 50 cents. And then underneath that, you experience the area’s highest rated and most reviewed dog trainer. Why is scheduling your first lesson for 50 cents and that we have packages available to fit any budget, why is that, that little clarifier of we have packages available to fit any budget, why is that so important? Well, that’s super important because some people think this is going to be super expensive. And these other trainers are like, hey, it’s going to be three weeks for $4,000. And they don’t even see the dog first. So people want you to be able to come out, see their dog, go over different options with them, tell you more about yourself. And that’s what we do for $0.50. We go and we actually evaluate the dog. And then fit any budget. That part’s important because some people might think that they can’t afford it and they’ll just click off or whatever. So we want to make sure that everyone knows we can fit anyone’s budget. It’s so important, everybody out there, if you have a website, you have to put it this way. You have to put the most important thing first. And again, you go to You can learn more about this. But again, that’s how that works. Now you scroll down and now you start to see information that is very important, but not as important as the main thing. So we start to see all of the things you can do for people that have a dog, that want to have that Tulsa dog trained professionally by a Tulsa dog trainer, where you start talking about is your dog causing you to lose sleep and holding you hostage? Discover the proven solutions that we provide to help your dog to truly become your best friend. Stop leash pulling, teach your dog to come when you say come, prevent dog jumping, reduce aggressive behaviors, etc. And as you work your way down the website, and maybe I’m wrong folks, maybe you’re on right now and you’re going to read the whole page. Maybe you’re the guy that does. There’s a tool called, that shows us where people go on the website and where they don’t. And even though the content at the very bottom of the website. So the most important stuff has to be first, okay? So we’re talking about branding. I’m telling you, books, branding. You’ve got to make sure that your branding is positive and that it conveys confidence. You want your branding to convey confidence. You want people to look at your website and that first impression has to wow people. It can’t just exist. Your branding has to wow people. Your branding has to create that wow moment for people. So we get into branding. Now if you do these, if you implement these processes like Michael Levine teaches and like we just taught you, you’re going to start to have some success. However, I think there’s this branding issue that people are dealing with right now? Where there’s a lot of people that think they’re an iconic living legend and a household name, but they’re not. I’m going to give a few examples, I’ll be very vague here, but I’m going to give a few examples. So years ago I worked with a guy who worked in an industry where it’s very competitive. There’s a lot of people in his industry. He’s not the only one. And so I helped him build a website that came up top in the search results. I helped him develop a no-brainer offer. I taught him, I’m teaching you right now, folks, and we really, really built it over time. And there was a time for about two years when working with this guy that he was very faithful. Now, you’re always getting video reviews, JT. You’re always getting Google reviews. Why can’t you ever stop getting Google reviews and video reviews? Because Google thinks you die. So it’s kind of like the heartbeat of Google. And if you just stop, well, then Google thinks you’re dead and you no longer are in business and you no longer do this. And then also because the customer is always looking. So they always want to see that you’re recently getting reviews, you’re still in business. It’s kind of like the heartbeat of the business. Now I’m not saying that Ryan Tedder is somebody you want to pattern your life after. I’m not saying that Michael Levine is somebody that you should hold up as a deity in your mind. What I am saying is these are people that have had success for decades. Decades. Plural. Right? So if you’re if you meet Michael Levine or you meet Ryan Tedder they’re both on their grind at all times. They’re grinding. So this person I’m speaking of I don’t I won’t be very vague I’m not trying to throw him under the bus, I’m just using it as a teaching example. We would have our weekly meeting and the guy would consistently get video reviews and Google reviews and things were great. I helped him improve his brand. I helped him go to the level where all of a sudden, dude’s driving some incredible cars. Dude has a big house. There’s a lot of energy there. Dude has a brand that is working and he’s creating success and people start to know him, his own circle, they start to know this guy is successful. But if you were at a bar or a restaurant, I don’t know that anybody would know who Michael Levine is. I’m going to put his face on today’s show so you can see it. I just don’t know that a lot of people go, holy crap, you’re the guy that did the PR for Nike and Pizza Hut and George Carlin. SIGN MY FACE RIGHT NOW! I just wouldn’t see it. I couldn’t see it. I don’t know, again Ryan Tedder, I don’t know how well known he is to the average person. I mean he’s had his own hit TV shows, he’s been featured on mainstream media commercials, he’s the most, he’s the best selling songwriter of the last two decades and he’s actually beaten virtually everybody’s record in the history of pop music with the most hits. I don’t know that a lot of people, if he walked into our office, would go, dude, you’re the guy. I don’t see that. I wouldn’t. I mean, I think, I try to think about the people that are of that level. I think if, like him or not, I’m not saying I endorse these people, I’m just giving an example. You like him or not, if Kanye West walked in, he would go, dude, that’s guy named Wes. Because he’s so omnipresent. Like him or not, if Usher walked in, you’d probably go, that’s Usher. If you saw President Trump, who I do like, you’d say, that’s Trump. Hey, hey, hey, hey, wow. Also the energy changes. Wow, that’s Tim Tebow. Hey, come on, come on. Woo, yeah, yeah. All of a sudden you’re like, let’s throw the ball around, let’s go. It’s just like there’s something, there’s an energy of like, let’s get a wig on! Let’s get a Trump wig on! Yeah! Woo! Trump it! I don’t know that you do that when you see Ryan Tedder, you walk him by and you say, is that Ryan Tedder? It’s too late to apologize. It’s too late. Like, were you singing? I just had to because it’s Ryan Tedder! It’s right in my face! So what I find is that most people have a distorted perception of reality. It’s where you think you’re a big deal, but you’re not. It’s where you think you’re famous, but you’re not. When you think you’re famous and you’re really about as well known as a picture of a random person’s anus, what am I saying? I mean, if you were a doctor and they’re like, whose anus is that? I don’t know. Frankly, quit showing me those photos. But there’s people that think they’re famous, but they’re not. Yeah, I mean, it always makes me think of Bow Wow. Bow Wow. So, I don’t know how much people know about it. The rapper? Yeah, the rapper. Oh, man. I don’t know how much people know about Bow Wow, but there’s a couple of funny stories. And you probably don’t even know these stories. Tell me about Bow Wow. Bow Wow, because it used to be a big deal, right? Yeah, and by the way, for anybody who hasn’t heard, again, I think this is the thing real quick. We need to give a little context here. Yeah. Bow Wow used to do some music with Jermaine Dupri. Now, there was a time in music history, and we’ll go back to you, where every song kind of sounded the same. There was a time where, like, it’s probably about a five-year period of time there where most of the songs sounded the same. So let me just kind of queue up one of those songs. I think a lot of people who are listeners might not even remember his songs. Yeah. So let me just give a second, just give a little context, because there was a time when Jermaine Dupri was writing hit songs for Usher. He was putting out songs for So So Def, he was putting out songs for a lot of R&B groups. That was kind of his niche. Here, let’s crank it up. Let me get it. Here comes Lil Bow Wow. Let me get it. I don’t know if anybody remembers that, but there was a time where for some reason a young kid rapping about women twice his age was acceptable. But that was, let me do one more just so people can remember this. This is Lil Bow Wow. Lil Bow Wow is almost taller than Jermaine Dupri, fun fact. Okay, so let’s see. All right. So, but anyway, so there was a time where Bow Wow was in the top 40 of music and it was probably about a three year window of time. Yeah. Back to you. A three year window of time, but he still thinks he’s there. He still thinks he’s there. So he has been notorious for posting things and then getting called out on them for not being the actual things. Right. Like for instance, he recorded himself, so he’s videoing himself, he’s taking a selfie, and there’s a school field trip, and he’s in a school field trip, and I know we’re on audio only, but there’s videos of everything I’m about to tell you. And he has his hoodie up, and he’s filming himself, and he’s like, these people don’t even know I’m Bow Wow. These people don’t even know who I am. So even if you had your hood off, they wouldn’t know who you were. Yeah, so if you look up like little bow wow field trip field trip little bow wow or little bow wow thinks he’s famous or one of those things yeah I got it yeah so that top one right there oh yeah oh shit get out so and then other people make like stitch it and they make other videos like making fun of them. And then another thing Bow Wow did, but people live like this right? So they think they’re more important than they are. Bow Wow has paid actors or people to chase him down the street like they’re fans. Okay. Now real quick just so we’re clear, Tai Lopez is famous for this. Tai Lopez will have a jet and on the jet there will be women who are in the jet who are… Have you seen Tai Lopez videos? Yeah, yeah you showed me some of them. Okay, I encourage everybody to look up just type in Tai Lopez jet because he’ll have these women who are in the jet. Here we go. You know what I like more than flying in a private jet like this? My books. There’s women in the jet with him? Actually not, but I do bring books with me. There are scantily clad cleavage showing women who are in his jet with him and he’s talking about… You know what I like more than flying in a private jet like this? My books. Actually not, but I do bring books with me because we were just talking a little bit earlier on, the question was how to figure out what you should do with your life, like your destiny, what you’re meant to do. Sure, they were not talking about that at all. So that’s the thing though, you’re saying that there are people that think they’re famous and they’re not. Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, or they just keep doing things and they run their businesses like this where they’re running it like everyone should know who they are. Take home shows for instance. People buy a booth, they sit there, and they sit back in the back of the booth and text the whole time, and they expect people to come to the home show and just want to pay them money. Well, okay, now let me just give you an example. Back to my client I was telling you about. So the client, every week, they’re doing a great job. They’re getting Google reviews, video reviews, writing content, and they are starting to make money, okay? And then our meeting, they’re like, I can’t make this week’s meeting, I can’t make it. I wanna go, can’t make it. But I’ll send somebody my place. And then it becomes, hey, I don’t have any Google reviews this week because I’ve been so busy, no video reviews. Now I’m not gonna mention this guy’s name, but I just wanna tell you this as an example. So then I start noticing that basically everyone who leaves him a review is irritated. Everyone is pissed. And everybody is irritated. Nobody’s happy. The bad reviews are flowing in. And I said, well, we can make, I didn’t know that, I noticed the reviews are bad. I’m like, hey, we could, if you want, call your customers and schedule video reviews for you if you’re too busy. He’s like, ah, you don’t want to call them right now because a lot of them are frustrated. I’m like, what do you mean a lot of them are frustrated? Well, pretty much all of our customers are really frustrated right now. And I go, well, why are they frustrated? He said, well, you got to understand, I’m going to a different level now. Okay, I’m going to a different level. And the person uses the phrase, I am going to a different level. And I remember going, okay, and he goes, because I’m going to this different level, I just want you to know, I know you’ve helped me to go to that level, you know, 10X growth, but moving forward, I’m gonna have you work with my new person over here because I’m going to a different level and certain people that got me here aren’t the ones who are gonna get me where I’m going. And then all of this person’s, because we have business conferences, these people come in from all over the country. So this particular person, you know, he often would attend workshops, although he’s not in Tulsa, not from Tulsa, but a lot of people meet each other. And so people that like live in Florida are calling me going, I can’t get a hold of the dude I met at your workshop. I cannot reach him. He used to be reachable. And now when I text him, somebody who’s not him calls me back and talks about how he’s going to a different level. And then all of a sudden, the person who’s not famous begins to ask me for recommendations for a security team. Like, who do you reckon? I said, what? He says, I know you do conferences. Who do you use for your security? And I say, just to be clear, at my events, you may see Eric Trump, okay? Therefore, I get security for Eric Trump because Eric Trump is the son of the 45th president of these United States. I happen to like him, I consider him to be a friend, but let’s just say you don’t, or you do, either way, that makes sense. But I don’t have an armed escort for me. You’ve stayed with me at the events. I sleep at an Airbnb with a bunch of dudes who are on our team. I sleep at the hotel, like a holiday inn. I’m with you guys. I’m there. Yeah. Because I don’t have an inflated reality distortion where I believe that I’m a big deal and I’m not. Yeah, well there’s even speakers on the tour who are a big deal who drives themselves. Mike Lindell. Yeah, Mike Lindell. That’s what I was thinking of. He drives himself. I’ve never seen him with security. In a rented Hyundai, typically. He just shows up. He just walks through the crowd. He does whatever. Right. So he doesn’t live in that world where he thinks he’s somebody that he’s not. So let’s talk about it for a second. I’m going to give people some action steps, some real meat on the bone here. So here are some action steps you want to take on today’s show. So first off, you’ve got to optimize your website. You’ve got to optimize your website so people can find you. You need to optimize the branding. The branding of your website. You say, how’s that different? You want to optimize the search engine optimization of your website. That’s one. Two, optimize the branding of your website. Step three, design a system to over deliver. Come on! You have to have a system where you wow your customers. Step four, you have to gather objective, objective Google reviews from the customers that you wow. Come on, somebody out there, you’re getting what I’m saying. What happens is, is somebody out there though, you want to skip the part of actually doing a good job, and you just want to stack your… because you get that initial branding, you get a little success and if you’re not careful, you don’t actually make sure your customers are wowed. So we go back to Make Your Dog Epic. And I think about the five wow benefits and you’re going to ongoing training again this weekend. Again, and this is… if anybody knows anything about J.T. Lawson and, continual education, the word is Kaizen, okay? You say, Kaizen, yeah. K-A-I-Z-E-N. It’s this idea of continual improvement. What am I saying? Look it up, folks. Kaizen, K-A-I-Z-E-N. Kaizen is continuous improvement. The concept of referring to business activities that continuously improve all functions. The idea is you’re constantly trying to make it better. It’s an everyday thing. So you’re going out to training here. Why are you going out to training this weekend to learn from perhaps one of the world’s most recognized positive reinforcement dog trainers, even though you already are a very well-known dog trainer? Yeah, because you can’t stop learning. So you have to always learn new ways, and other people have different ways that might work better than yours and you just have to be humble enough to learn from them. So like there’s somebody trained LeBron James, somebody trained Michael Jordan, somebody trained Tiger Woods, like all these people who are great, they still had trainers. So even though I think I know a lot about dog training, I’m humble enough to understand that other people have different ways of doing it and I want to go learn from the best of the best and just keep learning. And that way it transfers over to it’s easier to train the dog, it’s easier to train clients, it’s easier on everyone. And that’s the whole goal is to make systemizable processes that anyone can follow. Now tell me this for a second. You know, you’ve got this Kaizen philosophy of continual improvement. It’s constantly, and you’re actually excited to go to this training. Tell me about the guy that’s training you. What other celebrity big-time dogs has he trained? Yeah, so he’s trained dogs like Bingey. He’s worked in, he’s had TV shows on Animal Planet. He’s done… Bingey? Yeah, Bingey. Oh man, Animal Planet? Oh yeah. This guy’s sick! And he also went to, he worked at, he trained to work as a SeaWorld for a while. Oh come on! He’s done a bunch of stuff, so I’m super excited to learn from him, and he’s bringing another trainer in. So, once we get through with that, we’ll start talking about him, but that’s the training we’re doing. And again, I want to be very clear, you’re talking about going for ongoing training. You’ve already been trained, but you’re getting more training. You’re never done getting training. Correct. It’s Kaiser! Never done. So, hopefully, I’m going to give everybody five calls to action on today’s show. One, if you have a website that’s looking hood and not good, make sure you do some search engine optimization. If your website feels like it was made in the ghetto, hello, make sure that you optimize that thing. You don’t want your website to look bad, because if your website looks bad, the amount of leads you get will be sad, you’ll be depressed, you may live in a van down by the river. Get it done, optimize your website. You say, I don’t know how to optimize my website. That happens to be something that we do. If you go to, we optimize the websites of all of our clients and you’re going to learn more about these clients by simply going to thrive time show Calm thrive time show comment click it on testimonials second. You can optimize the branding You got optimize the brain the site has to look good, but it also has to be search engine optimized Those are two different ideas You have to optimize the search engine optimization of the website people have to be able to find it in the search results People have to be able to find the website in the search results second You got to optimize the branding third you have to design a system to over-deliver. Now, JT, we’ve been talking about this for a while, but one of the things that we’re doing right now is more and more people are starting to reference Make Your Dog Epic on shows, on conversations, on social medias. When they do that, more and more people begin to refer the website. They say, go to this website, go here, go there. There will eventually be a time and place where you’re going to have hundreds of thousands of people all over the country linking to you, telling people about you, celebrating you, but you still have to wow every customer. Yeah. Why? Because you can’t, it would be like doing all the branding of McDonald’s or Arby’s or Chick-fil-A. Arby’s. And then having, and then being Arby’s and saying, hey, we have the meats, and then having no meat. Or having a terrible product and it’s you’re never gonna get referred back. So that’s what you have to just like if we always got dog trainers or dog training clients but then we did a bad job, people will soon start to leave bad reviews, they’ll start to leave bad video reviews and other people will start to know and they’ll never refer us out and we won’t get more clients. So it’s really really important that you wow every customer. Now point number four is you have to gather objective reviews from customers that actually like you. And then point five, finally, you’ve got to gather those video reviews from customers that love you. Now, folks, on part two of today’s show, we are featuring an interview with Michael Levine. This is the public relations consultant of choice for Nike, Pizza Hut, George Carlin, Nancy Kerrigan. You’re going to love this interview. Then on part three of today’s show, Ryan Tedder is going to be, I’m going to put in a video clip of Ryan Tedder teaching you how to write music. Like he’ll actually walk you through his process for writing music. I think it’s fascinating. I think you’re going to enjoy it. And again, I think it’s important that you study successful people and figure out how they did it. To learn more about dog training in Tulsa, go to And then on part four of today’s show, what? There’s part four? Part four of today’s show, we are doing testimonials. We’re going to have back-to-back testimonials from real clients that we’ve really worked with to help them really grow their business here at the Thrive Time Show. So for anybody out there, if you’re looking for a checkup from, kind of a checkup from your neck up, schedule a free 13-point assessment today to grow your business at JT, we’re going to end this segment with a boom. Are you prepared? I’m ready. Here we go. 3, 2, 1, boom! Alright, Thrive Nation, on today’s show at 710 in the morning, on the day of my birth, I’m recording this show actually, I’m going to be discussing the deepest subject in the history of the world. No actually I’m not, it’s just that when you play deep music, it all of a sudden makes it seem as though what I’m saying is somehow more profound, more incredible, more enlightening. Folks, what I want to talk about today is perception, and public relations. And why do people actually trust the media? You see on today’s edition of the Thrive Time Show, I’m going to be interviewing Michael Levine. Michael Levine is the best-selling PR expert in the world. He’s called the Michael Jordan of PR. And he’s the founder, the inventor, the creator of what’s called the Tiffany Theory. Let me read it to you. Michael Levine says, actually let me not read it to you because if I read it to you and you don’t know who he’s represented you won’t care. So let me read it with a deep kind of a deep announcer voice. Here we go. Throughout Michael Levine’s historic career he has represented 58 Academy Award winners, 34 Grammy Award winners, 43 New York Times bestselling authors, comedians George Carlin, Joan Rivers, Sam Kenneson, and Rodney Dangerfield. He’s represented musicians Michael Jackson, David Bowie, and Ray Charles. As I mentioned earlier, he’s considered by most PR enthusiasts and experts as the Michael Jordan of entertainment PR. So who is Michael Levine? Okay, Michael Levine was born in 1956 as a dyslexic, he’s become a dyslexic best-selling author. What? Yes, he was born in 1956 and has become a dyslexic best-selling author, a public relations expert who over time has become my friend. Michael Levine is the best-selling author of one of the most incredible PR books of all time titled Guerrilla PR 2.0 This book forever changed the way that I view the press the media the news branding in public relations Throughout Michael Levine’s legendary career despite being dyslexic as I mentioned He’s become a best-selling author an entrepreneur a publicist and he’s worked with countless big-time celebrities and his theory goes like this he says if you give someone a present and if you give it to them in a Tiffany box it’s likely that they’ll believe that the gift has a higher perceived value than if you gave it to them and no box or a box of less prestige that’s not because the receiver of the box is a fool but instead because we live in a culture in which we gift wrap everything. Our politicians, our corporate heads, our movie and TV stars, and even our toilet paper. Public relations is like gift wrapping. Oh, I screwed that up. Public relations is like gift wrapping. Did that echo work for you? So now, how does public relations work? Well, okay, if you have a product or a service that you’re trying to sell to humans on the planet, for whatever reason, most people will reject the product or service that you’re pitching. Yes, when you are selling a product or service to your ideal and likely buyer, most buyers who have a sound mind simply will not believe you or your offer or the offer you’re making. Why? Ask yourself. Why don’t you believe most advertisements product claims that are made during late-night infomercials and commercials are you trying to tell me that the Shake-white doesn’t work. However For reasons that I cannot fathom most people trust the media They believe the news thus for whatever reason people choose to believe that you and your product is more credible if the media The media celebrates your company, endorses your products, or praises the products and services you offer. So on today’s show, Michael Levine is going to walk us through six key points of how public relations works. Point number one, when you buy ads, many people will not believe you or the offer you’re making. Point number two, when you score a public relations win, it gives your advertising more credibility. When you get featured in the news when it says as seen on Forbes for some reason people think I’m more credible because I was the entrepreneur of the year at the age of 20 for the Tulsa Chamber of Commerce. For some reason people think I’m more credible because I know Eric Trump. For some reason people think I’m less credible because I know Eric Trump. You get the idea though right? Point number three. If you have a good story or message, you’re transparent and are authentic. If you can say words. If you are authentic, you can be effective. Point number four, PR brings forth a kind of credibility that ads don’t. Point number five, how Michael Levine got started in the world of public relations. And point number six, we break down Michael Levine’s Tiffany theory. We break it down like fractions. We break it down like a car that’s got flat tires. We break it down like a smartphone that you just dropped into a toilet that was slightly cracked. We break it down like the Western civilization when you allow woke ideology to spread on college campuses. Folks, we break it down. Oh, yes, we break it down. We break it down like Miss Wilson was breaking down sentence structure to me in second grade when she was teaching me how to diagram sentences. Yes, folks, we break it down. Folks, we we break this show down like a. Like a 1989 Ford Escort when my transmission without college folks today’s interview michael e for me to your ear holes we’re still going or breaking down p r we don’t care about the breakdowns because we have a triple-a membership gold star member which allows us to have a limited towing to our vehicle and just get on with our lives. We can drive for another 30 miles and break it down again. Just call AAA again. It’s unlimited because we’re a gold member. That’s how we’re gonna break down PR. We’re gonna break it down folks. Like… Get ready to enter the Thrive Time Show. 3, 2, 1, boom! All right, Thrive Nation, welcome back to the conversation. It is an rare opportunity to interview the actual man behind what is known in the PR world as the Tiffany Theory. If you don’t know what the Tiffany Theory is, the Tiffany Theory… I’ll go ahead and… Chuck, can you read the notable quotable to describe… This is the notable quotable from Michael Levine, the most successful, arguably the He’s the guy who’s worked with Nancy Kerrigan, he’s worked with Cameron Diaz, he’s worked with Pizza Hut, he’s worked with Nike, and he wrote the Tiffany Theory, which has totally changed the game for PR, and we had a chance to sit down with him and have him break it down for us. Peel back that onion. Peel back the onion. But read the notable quotable for us, my friend, before we hop into it. Whenever I first heard this, years ago when I started working with you, this really connected with me. It makes so much sense, okay? Yes. So the Tiffany theory. If you give someone a present and you give it to them in a Tiffany box, it’s likely that they’ll believe the gift has a higher perceived value than if you give it to them in a box, in no box or a box of less prestige that’s not because the receiver of the gift is a fool but instead because we live in a culture in which we gift wrap everything our politicians our corporate heads our movies and TV stars and even our toilet paper. Public relations is like gift wrapping so michael levine breaks down the tiffany theory and how he got started in the world of PR? Well, we have a kind of humorous way of discussing it in our industry, which is to say that advertising is what you pay for and PR is what you pray for. And what that means is that, you know, if you take out an ad in Time or Newsweek or People or US News and World Report or USA Today or the Wall Street Journal or the New York Times you get a certain cost and the ad has a certain believability by virtue of the fact that it’s an ad. On the other hand if you had a story in the Wall Street Journal or USA Today or the New York Times or the LA Times. Its believability would be at a rate of at least 10 to 1, because it would come with the imprimatur or the authority of the Wall Street Journal, USA Today. So I think that is what’s underneath the idea that PR, advertising is what you pay for, PR is what you pray for. And today, the world is so cynical. People start with the assumption, they start with guilty until proven innocent, not innocent until proven guilty. And so, when you educate your customers about the potential value of your product or service and you do it through the media. You get a believability that is significantly greater than if you do it with, you know, an advertiser. But if you have a good story, a good message, and you’re transparent, you’re authentic, I think you can put forth a message that can be very effective. With PR, you get, it brings forth a kind of credibility that ads don’t. What you say about yourself is not nearly as important as what is said about it by others. How did you get started in the PR business? How did you get started? All my life as a youth, I had two passions. I was interested in the entertainment industry, and I was interested in politics. So now I’m 17, scared and skinny, dyslexic, no money, no job, no education, I’ve got to figure out what to do. And when you’re 18, scared and skinny, I think you’ve come to conclude what I came to conclude, which is, Washington is Hollywood for ugly folks. And I come out here. See, I just look stupid, Clay. I just look stupid. I come out here where the pretty people are. And that’s how the whole damn thing began. So in a nutshell, now that you’ve kind of ascended to the point where you’re known as one of the top publicists of all time, one of the top PR guys of all time, you came up with this thing called the Tiffany Theory. Right. And the Tiffany Theory, and this is from your book, Guerrilla PR 2.0, which by the way, I bought about 35 copies of, so I probably made $35. I call that decision to purchase 35 copies a good start. Yeah, I absolutely love your book. Guerrilla PR is the most widely used introduction to PR in the world. It’s not because of its brilliance nearly to the degree of its accessibility, which is what you’re talking about. Yeah, you really teach the concepts at a third grade level, which my mind can grasp. You say here, I define what I do as gift wrapping. If you package a bracelet in a Tiffany box, it will have a higher perceived value than if presented in a Kmart box. Same bracelet, different perception. How does this story pertain to small business owners across the country? Let’s say I own a plumbing business. How does this apply to me as a small business owner? Okay, so let’s first, let’s take your question, which is a good one, and let’s cut it into some pieces that are bite-sized and that we can think about. Okay, so first of all, I had a problem when I began my career in PR. May I tell you about that? Absolutely. First of all, I didn’t know how to do PR, and second of all, I didn’t know what it was. Other than that, I was in good shape. Right. So I had to come to, I had to create for myself and for others an understanding of what PR was. And I said that PR is analogous to gift wrapping. And so if I come to visit you today, I come to visit your wife today, and I give her a gift and I give it to her in a Tiffany box, in her mind, the gift would have a higher perceived value than if I gave it to her in no box or a box of less prestige. Now the reason that’s true is not because your wife is a jackass. It’s true because she lives in a culture in which we gift wrap everything. So we gift wrap our politicians and our corporate heads and our movie and TV stars and even our toilet paper. I’m Mike Levine and I thought I’d tell you this story maybe it’ll be of some value to you. You know about 25 years ago our PR firm was running hot as hell and we had six of the top 20 musical artists in America on the billboard charts. No company even had two and here we are with six. So we had the most number of successful artists in the country by far. But I still wanted to sign another musical artist who wasn’t been on the charts for a while, but I loved and respected greatly. I wanted to sign the great Ray Charles. Ray Charles. I decided that even though I had all these big stars, I was going to go after Ray Charles and I called him. And I ultimately did sign him. I did sign him. But I’d like to ask you, listening to this right now, to try to guess. Just close your eyes and try to guess how many times I called Ray Charles before I signed him. Are you going to… All right. Let’s try to close our eyes close our eyes here we go now. We’ll do it multiple choice Did I call them a ten times? B 20 times C 30 times D 40 times Or E more than 40 times. Now close your eyes. Now write down your answer. Write it down. Don’t you cheat now. Write down your answer. I’m gonna give you the correct answer in three seconds. One, two, three. All right, here we go. Correct answer is 46 times. I called Ray Charles’ office 46 times. And you want to hear something crazy? I didn’t even need Ray Charles. Here I had all the other big music stars. But I think the story for some of you may, may, may, may have impact when you think about all the tenacity required to go after your big dreams. I’m talking about little dreams, talking about big dreams. Anyway, I’m Michael Levine. Get ready to enter the Thrive Time Show. Three, two, one, boom! Alright, Thrive Nation, here we are back on a special edition podcast where we’re going to have an opportunity to sit down with the legendary PR guru, Michael Levine. This guy is the PR consultant of choice for President Bush, President Clinton, Michael Jackson, Prince, Pizza Hut, Nike, and he’s talking about how to be broke in America. Chuck, is this exciting for you? Have you found yourself wanting to know how to become broke? This is on the top of my to-do list. Actually, I need to figure out today how to become broke. So it’s kind of a topic that obviously is kind of sarcastic in nature, but he’s such a grinder I think he just wants to lay out for the listeners out there, hey do this and you will definitely lose and do this and you’ll be successful. Well he’s an intense guy, you can tell when you’re listening in, he’s been there and so it’s good to listen in and pay attention to what he’s saying. I’ll tell you what Thrive Nation, you might want to put on a helmet when you listen to this interview, this exclusive interview with the Michael Levine. If you want to prosper, if you want to, listen, here’s the number one rule. If you want to be broke in America, I’m going to tell you how to do it. Okay. Tip for the bottom. Okay. In case any of your audiences listening to us now and they’re saying, gee, I want to know how to be broke. How do I be broke? I’m going to tell you how to be broke in America. Ready? Here’s the number one thing you got to do if you want to be broke in America. Ready? Boom. Think like a victim. That’s what you got to do. If you think like a victim, I promise you, I promise you, you’re talking even about income inequity, which is a very, very, very, very serious problem. You say, wait, wait, wait, Mr. Levine, everything you’re saying is kind of interesting, but you know this game you’re talking about, this game, this game here, this is a rigged game. I know, you’re right. The game is not easy. The game is not fair. But, with enough burning maniacal rage and focus, the game is winnable. The game isn’t easy, the game isn’t fair. And here’s what you got to do. Spend, don’t sign up when you want to say, why isn’t the game fair? Don’t sign up for that class. What would victory look like? If it’s successful, what would that be like? If it’s unsuccessful, what would that be like? What would happen if this was out. Usually what happens with ideas, Clay, one of three things usually happens with ideas. It’s a strikeout, it’s a single, or a home run. If it’s a home run, you don’t need a plan. If it’s a single, you better try to figure out how to steal second. If it’s a strikeout, you better march your sorry ass into a room and figure out what the lessons are. Lessons learned the hard way. So let’s say there’s a small business owner right now. I see this all the time. There’s small business owners who are like, here’s what we’re gonna do. We’re gonna come up with this great PR campaign. We’re gonna do this, we’re gonna do that. We’ll do this, she’ll do this, he’ll do that, she’ll do this, and then you’re saying, if you add it all up, if we’re successful, if it’s just a single, it’s probably not worth doing. You better be a little resourceful or figure out how you’re gonna steal second. But you’re just saying, look at the outcome of where it would take you if it was a success and see if that’s worth your time. The entire song bows down to the melody because that’s what the human ear remembers more than the lyric. They remember the melody. 1, 2, 3. Based on whatever a track is or whatever the melody is, whatever the chords are, I kind of know where to go. 1, 2, 3, 4. And it’s on the and of the 4. Like if I’m going to do a pop thing, I might go high. I like that melody better, huh? I don’t know what I’m going to do until I do it, and this will be the first time I’ve ever done it in front of cameras in real time. I’ve been noted as saying many, many times that melody is the most important thing. The entire song bows down to the melody because that’s what the human ear remembers more than the lyric. They remember the melody. So I’m very hyper-focused on that in this next section. And what you’re about to see is me opening up a track, putting it into loop, putting putting the headphones on, turning the microphone on, and just spitballing. Tell me what you’re taking back Put me on the basic track, I know That you never lied, you know She said, time is what my life is for You don’t like this, you know And if you don’t get them, then I don’t mind. I just want something that you never get it lies. I know She said hey, I’ve been called a wet Come on I never hate is All right, so I’m just doing gibberish I kind of have a gist of a verse and I’m free I had no idea what I was doing before. I’m just free, whatever. Oh, that’s kind of an avid idea. That might be a chorus idea. Sometimes I just want you to carry me out to be the light on my beyond. All I want is some place to go. I’ll go back through I might do a couple more passes. My Before you know this you know beat that and if you don’t Don’t mind I just want something that you never get a lot of that at all Because they like this I’ll be crazy, but I don’t match you much. Maybe Maybe So, I’m going to edit some of this because I kind of like this first pass a lot. I just want something that you never get to lies I know Because a day like this I might be crazy But I don’t mind too much And maybe I just want somewhere to go Maybe I just want somewhere to go Want somewhere to go And I just want you to carry on with the life that I might be on All I want is some place to go, ooh But you gave me don’t love me no But you gave me some place to go Alright, so what I have here is this. I’ll do one more pass just to see, but I feel pretty Like I said earlier, usually my first pass has a lot in it that is the one What I can’t tell you is how did I think of that melody melody, which is probably the one question some people might be asking. And when I’m in sessions, if I do come up with something insane on the fly, that’s very often the question is from other writers, like, where the hell did you think of that? How did you think of that? Like, where did that come from? And I really don’t have an answer. That’s just years and years of writing songs. I, and years and years of listening. listening, you start, my brain starts to, or has assimilated based on whatever a track is or whatever the melody is, whatever the chords are, I kind of know where to go instinctively. Like what melodies, what shapes are going to work with those chords just because I’ve written over so many chord progressions. And if I think it might be a pop artist, if it’s Bieber or Shawn, then I’m going to get in the headspace of them. I’m going to sing it like I know the melody shapes that Sean would sing. I’ve written and produced with him many, many times and many, many other artists. If it’s Ellie Goulding or if it’s Normani, I know what they’re likely to sing melodically. I know where they’re going to go. And that’s from the short answer to that is just I just pay attention. I pay attention. I listen to that so much music and have for so many years that you instinctively know where to go. So I know that like if I shift this any more to the right, no pun intended, it’s going to feel more country, maybe too country. So I might shift it, and even how I sing it, if I sing it with any kind of twang at all, it could start to feel country, but I could easily flip this to be more like in, I hate saying Bieber territory, but more his territory or like a, you know, a pop artist. In a perfect world, I put it right down the middle, which is what I’m aiming for today. Something that like, could pitch to a handful of pop artists, a handful of country artists, just a good song. Very simple, good song, feel good song. ♪ It’s hard enough in times like these Put me on the way like bees, I know Cause you never wanna go I think now my gibberish is already starting to tell me what this song is going to be and what it’s about, which is good. I’m forming an idea. Put me on the base of the attack I know I don’t wanna take you back Got no place to go Tell me what you’re taking back Put me on the base of the attack I know Yeah, you never let us be known You said time is one mile I lie before You might be the one I know Yeah, and if you don’t Be the one I know Yeah Yeah You need that little yeah in there Yeah, and if you don’t get I’m gonna go ahead and play it. Oh, I want it, I just want something that you never get a lot of that, oh Oh, you could stay, I just want something that you never get a lot of that, oh Oh, then I could stay like this, I might be crazy, but I don’t mind I just want something that you never get a lot of that, oh Because a day like this I might be crazy, but I don’t mind too much of me Like this thing might be crazy, but I feel safe here with you baby Like this thing might be crazy, but I feel safe here with you baby And I don’t care like this, you’re ready to go Crazy, but I feel safe here with you baby And I don’t care like this, I don’t need no other place to go. I feel safe here with you baby and I’m not trying to find some place to go. So what I’m doing is, as the ideas hit me I like to record them more I forget them so I might change these lyrics 20 times this might be garbage I might throw the whole thing away I don’t know but forming an idea okay so I’m gonna do one more pass in case I get any other course ideas so I’m gonna say that it’s past one create a new track but the thing is I really like my verse, and I just feel like that is the verse. Like, I actually feel pretty solid. Like I said earlier, I’m more inclined… My first pass on a verse in pre, very often, not all the time, but two out of three times, ends up being the final. And then I’ll take a couple approaches at a chorus. So if I’m thinking, a pop artist like Bieber or whatever, he’s got a higher range than a lot of the country artists. So you could go, I could take this. The pre-chorus goes like this. Like if I’m going to do a pop thing, I might go higher like him. Anywhere you go, know that I’ll be yours Know that I’ll be treated, boy, the love they don’t Anywhere you want, know that I’ll be yours Know that I’ll be treated strong, darling, I’ll be yours Oh yeah, be yours So, there’s another more pop approach. I might do one more just for fun. And just so I can preview these, I’m going to keep this simple. I’m just going to pull that down and I’ll leave the past one up there. That’s the first pass, right? I’m creating multiple tracks so I can preview my different chorus ideas and figure out which one I like better. Instinct is to roll with the first one because it’s easy, but that’s also being lazy, so I force myself to do a few more. So, mute that, mute this, and I’ll do one more pass on the chorus. But I’ve got to think about what I’m going to do first. Let’s see. Pay attention to where I start on the verse and the pre-chorus. So where you start a melody, it’s association with the first downbeat of that section. The downbeat, the one beat of the verse, the one beat of the pre-chorus. You need to pay attention to, is the melody starting before the one? Is it starting on the one? Is it starting after the one? And if you’re doing the same thing in each section, no matter how good the melodies are, you will upend the whole song. You’ll pull the rug out from underneath it because everything’s starting in the… The key is switching up your patterns, so the human ear isn’t just getting bored even if it doesn’t know why it’s like why is this boring? It’s like oh well every every part of the song starts on the 1b. You know starts on the down So I’m going to make sure as I’m doing it. I know that I like my verse I know that I like my pre and I’m pretty Pretty sure I like the chorus or both of them for different reasons So I want to see where am I starting on the verse in the pre and this final pass I do I’m going to intentionally start at a different point, so This is the end of the phrase three four so Starting on the two. All right, so the verse starts on the two. Let’s see where the pre starts She said So it starts kind of on the end of the four of the end of the bar so it’s one so one two three four and it’s on the end of the four. So let’s see when the my choruses start here they both started at different times. So this starts the last chorus starts two two beats before the chorus. Anywhere you go, know that I’ll be yours. Know that I’ll be fit and want to love you, don’t. Anywhere you want, know that I’ll be yours. Know that I’ll be fit and strong. I like that melody better, huh? Know that I’ll be yours. Know that I’ll be fit and don’t want to love you, no. Oh. Oh, that’s nice. No other love belongs to us It’s strong, tall, that I be yours Know that I’ll be yours Know that I’ll be all mine All I ever need of you Know that I’ll be all right Never been like before Never, never been like before Know that I’ll be all right Everything and more Know that I’ll be alright, everything and more. Know that I’ll be alright, everything and more. Alright, there we go. Know that I’ll be young, know that I’ll be free. Know that I’ll be alright, know that I’ll be young. Know that I’ll be alright, better than I’ve been before. I’m not gonna say that. I’m definitely not going with this lyric. So that’s one. Let me do a different one. I Just want something that you never get it I don’t know why it’s going a little more country. Maybe it is. Maybe it wants to be pop. I’m on love, I’m on touchin’, I think it’s all honey and some hushin’ I’m on love, I’m on touchin’, I think it’s all honey and some hushin’ I’m on love, I’m on touchin’, I think it’s all honey and some hushin’ I’m on love, I’m all touching, I think love’s funny and submersion, I think I’ve had it, it’s been a while, I just want you gone. Alright, so I have like three different approaches here on the chorus. I’ll go through all three. And I may keep one, I may combine two, I may get rid of all of them. There’s no way to tell. Hey, I’m Ryan Wimpey. I’m originally from Tulsa, born and raised here. I’ve definitely learned a lot about life design and making sure the business serves you. The linear workflow, the linear workflow for us in getting everything out on paper and documented is really important. We have workflows that are kind of all over the place. Having linear workflow and seeing that mapped out on multiple different pages, it’s really important. I think we have a lot of people that are doing that. I think we have a lot of people that are doing that. I think we have a lot of people that are doing that. seeing that mapped out on multiple different boards it’s pretty awesome that’s really helpful for me. The atmosphere here is awesome I definitely just stared at the walls figuring out how to make my facility look like this place this place rocks that it’s invigorating the walls are super it’s just very cool the atmosphere is cool the people are nice it’s a pretty cool place to be. Very good learning atmosphere. I literally want to model it and steal everything that’s here at this facility and basically create it just on our business side. Play is hilarious. I literally laughed so hard that I started having tears yesterday. And we’ve been learning a lot, which, you know, we’ve been sitting here, we’ve been learning a lot, and so the humor definitely helps. It breaks it up. But the content is awesome, off the charts. And it’s very interactive, you can raise your hand. It’s not like you’re just listening to the professor speak. The wizard teaches, but the wizard interacts and he takes questions, so that’s awesome. If you’re not attending the conference, you’re missing about three quarters to half of your life. You’re definitely, it’s probably worth a couple thousand dollars. So you’re missing the thought process of someone that’s already started like nine profitable businesses. So not only is it a lot of good information, but just getting in the thought process of Clay Clark or Dr. Zellner or any of the other coaches, getting in the thought process of how they’re starting all these businesses. To me, just that is priceless. That’s money. Well, we’re definitely not getting upsold here. My wife and I have attended conferences where it was great information and then they upsold us like half the conference and I don’t wanna like bang my head into a wall and she’s like banging her head into the chair in front of her. Like, it’s good information, but we’re like, oh my gosh, I wanna strangle you, shut up and go with the presentation that we paid for and that’s not here, there’s no upsells or anything, so that’s awesome. I hate that. It makes me angry. So glad that’s not happening. So the cost of this conference is quite a bit cheaper than business college. I went to a small private liberal arts college and got a degree in business, and I didn’t learn anything like they’re teaching here. I didn’t learn linear workflows. I learned stuff that I’m not using and I haven’t been using for the last nine years. So what they’re teaching here is actually way better than what I got at business school. And I went what was actually ranked as a very good business school. I would definitely recommend that people would check out the Thrive 15 conference. The information that you’re going to get is just very, very beneficial. And the mindset that you’re going to get, that you’re going to leave with, is just absolutely worth the price of a little bit of money and a few days worth of your time. I’m Rachel with Tip Top K9 and we just want to give a huge thank you to Clay and Vanessa Clark. Hey guys, I’m Ryan with Tip Top K9. Just want to say a big thank you to Thrive 15. Thank you to Make Your Life Epic. We love you guys, we appreciate you and really just appreciate how far you’ve taken us. This is our old house, right? This is where we used to live years ago. This is our old neighborhood. See? It’s nice, right? So this is my old van and our old school marketing. And this is our old team. And by team, I mean it’s me and another guy. This is our new house with our new neighborhood. This is our new van with our new marketing. And this is our new team. We went from four to 14, and I took this beautiful photo. We worked with several different business coaches in the past, and they were all about helping Ryan sell better and just teaching sales, which is awesome, but Ryan is a really great salesman, so we didn’t need that. We needed somebody to help us get everything that was in his head out into systems, into manuals and scripts, and actually build a team. So now that we have systems in place, we’ve gone from one to 10 locations in only a year. In October 2016, we grossed 13 grand for the whole month. Right now it’s 2018, the month of October. It’s only the 22nd, we’ve already grossed a little over 50 grand for the whole month, and we still have time to go. We’re just thankful for you, thankful for Thrive and your mentorship, and we’re really thankful that you guys have helped us to grow a business that we run now instead of the business running us. Just thank you, thank you, thank you, times a thousand. Light that spark fire nation, JLD here and welcome to Entrepreneurs on Fire brought to you by the HubSpot podcast network with great shows like Business Made Simple. Today we’ll be breaking down the proven processes and systems that you need to implement to build a time and financial freedom creating business. To drop these value bonds, I brought Clay Clark and Ryan Wimpey into EO Fire Studios. Clay is former USSBA Oklahoma Entrepreneur of the Year, founder of several multimillion dollar businesses and Amazon bestselling author. And today for our nation, we will be talking about quality leads, getting turnkey marketing systems that will get you those leads. We’ll talk about the irresistible offer and scale and grow exponentially once you’ve nailed that and then hitting the repeat button and so much more when we get back from thanking our sponsors. Looking for a place where you can experience live interactions with your audience? Then Speakeasy is for you. I’m loving creating daily content on Speakeasy and I know you will too. Visit to download the app and go live today. Success Story hosted by Scott D. Clary is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network, the audio destination for business professionals. Success Story features Q&A, keynote presentations, and convos on sales, marketing, and more. A recent episode on how to protect your business in times of crisis is a must listen. Listen to Success Story wherever you get your podcasts. Ryan, say what’s up to Fire Nation and share something that you believe about becoming successful that most people disagree with. What is up Fire Nation? I’m Ryan Winfield with Tip Top K9. One thing about being successful, it has absolutely nothing to do with your passion, you may have to put that on hold to create scalable, repeatable systems in order to succeed. Do not focus on the passion. Well, Fire Nation, you need to be excited about today because as I mentioned in the introduction, we’re talking about proven processes, proven systems that will help you build time and financial freedom, creating your business. And it’s not just Ryan on the mic, but we have Clay Clark on the mic. And this is actually the first time I have had a guest in my 3,700 episodes crack double digits because this is Clay’s 10th appearance on Entrepreneurs on Fire. So Clay, let’s start with you, brother. Friar Nation wants to know where we get quality leads. How can we create turnkey marketing systems that produce quality leads? Brother, take it away. Well I met Ryan Wimpy here of Tip Top K9. This was a guy who was passionate about dog training and he really knew how to sell well if he got quality leads. And so if you’re listening out there right now you have a great product or a great service and you just need more quality leads what we have to do tonight I do this with every single client we work with we have to identify what we call a three-legged marketing stool. What is the most effective way? Not the only way, but what is the most effective way? Not what are all the ways, but what are the three most effective ways to generate leads for your business? And so for Ryan, we identified that search engine optimization was absolutely very important. The second area we discovered is that social media marketing was very important. And the third area that we discovered was this thing called the Dream 100 which Chet Holmes, the best-selling author of a great book called The Ultimate Sales Machine, Chet Holmes, a great, great author, the late great business consultant, called the Dream 100 where Brian needed to get all of the veterinarians, all the dog groomers in his local areas to refer him. And since we implemented the search engine optimization domination, the social media marketing, and the Dream 100 system. Tip Top has now grown from one location that was, I would say, maybe doing well to now 17 thriving locations all across America. And I would predict by the end of 2022, we’ll probably end the year at 21 to 22 territories. Wow. I mean, that is intense stuff. Ryan, like when you were going through this, were you like, oh my God, this just totally makes sense. I’ve been like going a million miles an hour and a million different directions and not getting quality leads. I’m not putting words in your mouth. I’m just asking you, was this happening and how did what clay really structured for you change things? Yeah. So as far as the search engine definitely helped, you know, we had good map reviews, but we weren’t doing those other three. I wasn’t implementing a dream 100. We weren’t going out and seeing people. And so if I was getting in front of people, I had a sales coach before, Clay’s a business coach, and that’s why I found him. But I had a sales coach, so sales are doing good, but I only had so many of them, right? So it doesn’t matter how good you are if you’re not getting enough leads, right? And one thing I wanna also double down on, Fire Nation, that book that Clay talked about, The Ultimate Sales Machine, fantastic, you must read it. In fact, I’m good friends with Chet’s daughter, Amanda Holmes, and she just released the updated version of that book with of course, all of Chet’s genius in there with updated to, you know, the 2022 version. So that book just came out. So definitely worth a read in all the different areas. And Clay, I wanna talk about irresistible offers. We need to develop an irresistible offer for our first time customers. Why and how do we do this? Okay, well first off, if anybody listens right now and you go to forward slash EO fire, that’s one irresistible offer, forward slash EO fire or you can go to I’m just giving you two examples and let me throw in a third example. Why don’t you go to, So Shaw Homes is a home builder that I’ve helped to grow from, check this out, from $16 million a year of sales to $170 million of sales. So from 16 million to 170, 10 times, more than 10 times, almost 11 times growth, and we’ve done that in less than four years. Tip Top K9 has gone from one location to 17. And if you go to forward slash EO fire, you can see that I do these free consultations and people say, why do you do a free consultation? Well, frankly, it’s for my mental health, because JLD, you have great listeners who listen to your show, and they reach out all the time to want to attend a workshop, or they want to schedule one-on-one consulting, and they want to see if we’re a good fit. And your listeners are wonderful because they’re what I call diligent doers. They’re people that actually want to pursue their goals and turn their dreams into reality. However, people that don’t listen to your show, some people, you know, at three in the morning after three adult beverages, they fill out the form just to see what happens. You know, not your listeners, but other people do that. And so what you want to do is you want to make an offer so hot that the super intoxicated guy at 3 a.m. fills out the form and you’re ideal and likely buyer. So at Tip Top K9, the first dog training lesson is only a dollar. Now their average ticket, Ryan, how much is the average ticket if someone decides to hire you? Right now it’s about $2,200 to $2,800. So the average customer is spending $2,200 to $2,800 to pay Tip Top K9 to train their dog. But before they decide to commit $2,200 to dog training, they want to see if it’s a good fit. So the first lesson is $1. For Shaw Homes, your first consultation is free. Your 3D mock-up of your new home is free. They have all sorts of a free tour, a free interactive experience. That’s free. Or in the case of forward slash EO fire my first consultation is free so what you’re wanting to do if you’re listening right now you want to think about what’s something that you could offer that’s so hot so irresistible so amazing that you want to try it out you would actually be able to modify someone’s behavior let me give you one more example I was recently in San Diego where you’re from JLD I was in San Diego and I was not wanting to have a delicious piece of Asian cuisine. I was not thinking to myself, you know what, I want Asian cuisine right now. But I happen to be walking in this mall area and the guy comes out and says, would you like a free sample? I’m thinking, well, okay. And I tried the sample and it was phenomenal. And then it occurred to me, I think I’m hungry. And I ordered a meal. But that free sample, it was a generous sample. Now it was an ample sample that my human mind could handle. It was so good though, and I’m not kidding, I wasn’t thinking about having Asian cuisine, but it was so good, it altered my behavior, and it was like a tractor beam from Star Wars, and I couldn’t pull out of it, and I’m like, oh no! Next thing you know, I’m ordering the meal. It was phenomenal, so everybody out there, if you could go to your website, think about your business right now, folks, think about it. What is an offer that you could offer that’s so hot, so irresistible, that people can simply not resist it. An ample sample. That is definitely become part of my vocabulary. I love it for all the reasons. And once we figured out getting quality leads, once we’ve figured out our irresistible offer, how do we scale Clay? How do we grow exponentially? Well, the thing with Ryan’s business that was challenging is he’s sort of a dog genius. He knows how to train a dog and the proper way to train a dog and matriculate and coach up the dog so the dog is well behaved. And then the owner goes, wow, my dog used to eat everything. My dog used to eat my bride’s, my beautiful wife’s wedding dress. My dog’s eaten my shoes. My dog won’t stop urinating in the house. My dog’s crazy. And then they get the dog back and it’s a great. It’s a it’s a well-behaved dog So the question is how do you build a system so that other people who are not you? Can learn how to train a dog with the level of quality that Ryan can do So it became sitting down with Ryan and I would and I’ll let Ryan explain more detail And this was the part of the process that I don’t think he was passionate about and I wasn’t passionate about it, but in order to achieve financial freedom and time freedom, we had to turn everything into a checklist, everything into a process. And so we had to grind through the process of building a checklist and a process for everything. And now when somebody buys the tip top canine franchise, and correct me if I’m wrong, Ryan, but I think almost everybody who owns a tip top canine franchise now previously was not a dog trader. Every single one of them was not. So we got a former mortgage banker who bought a Tip Top K9 franchise, and now he’s making more money training dogs than he ever made in the mortgage industry. And that’s because the systems are so tight. So Ryan, maybe you could explain what that process was like. Because I know it was arduous. It was tedious. But now it’s created financial abundance. Yeah, so like I said, it wasn’t my passion. My passion was training dogs. But we took basically a two-page outline into a 60-page process manual, and then checklists for our boot camps, process and structure and outlines for our private lessons, for our take-home training, the sales script, our call center scripts, literally everything painstakingly sitting down and just line item by line item creating those scripts for the call center and the sales was probably the biggest thing because it took me or even training my trainers it used to take me six months to do what we do in six to eight weeks now. So now what’s happening here, and this is so powerful, JLD, is there’s a book called The Checklist Manifesto that I encourage everyone to read. The Checklist Manifesto is written by Atul Gawande. And what he talks about in that book, and this is wild, he talks about medical professionals that were able to dramatically decrease the amount of deaths in hospitals as a result of following a checklist. He talks about architects. They were able to decrease structural problems as a result of using checklists. He talks about, uh, aviation experts, pilots that were able to decrease the amount of errors they had by following checklists, and he talks about in his book that most people don’t like following a checklist and he writes here. And I’m quoting, he says the volume and complexity of what we know has it now exceeded our individual ability to deliver its benefits correctly, safely, or reliable without a checklist? He says, we don’t like checklists. They can be painstaking. They’re not too much fun. But I don’t think the issue here is mere laziness. There’s something deeper, more visceral going on when people walk away, not only from saving lives, but from making money. It somehow feels beneath us to use a checklist, an embarrassment. It runs counter to our deeply held beliefs about how the truly great among us, those who we aspire to be like, handle situations of high stakes and complexity. The truly great aren’t supposed to be daring. They improvise. They do not have protocols or checklists. He says, maybe our idea of heroicism needs updating. I just encourage everybody out there, if your business feels stuck, you want to sit down right now, make a list of all the things that you have to do on a daily basis that are, I call it craft, but core, repeatable, actionable processes. It’s craft, core, repeatable, actionable processes. Anything that you do that you’re just, it’s tedious, repetitive tasks, and find a way to make a checklist or a system out of it so that you can teach a new employee, a new hire, or in Ryan’s case, a new franchisee, how to do it quickly. And in my office, every position we have, JLD, in my offices, we can teach somebody how to do that job in 15 hours or less. And that’s my goal. And then the Tip Top Canine franchise, when people go to to learn about buying a Tip Top Canine, from the time that somebody shows up as a mortgage banker with no knowledge of training dogs to the time they leave as an expert dog trainer, I believe, Ryan, I believe it’s six weeks now? Yep, six weeks. Six weeks. So that’s what you want to do, is you want to build a system. It’s kind of like reverse college. College no matter what you want to learn, it takes four years. In the world of entrepreneurship, you want it to take no longer than four hours if you can. I will say this. I must kind of be a weird person because I love checklists. I love checklists. Listen, I’ve always loved checklists. And I think there’s a reason for it. While you were talking, Clay, I was like, why do I love checklists? I love checklists because I hate having to do something a second time or a third time. I hate doing something wrong and being like, I’m going to start back over again. I literally hate that feeling. And so man, give me a checklist because I will go through step by step by step and I will be happy the whole time knowing that I’m doing it right the first time. That is so important to me for some reason. A fire nation. I hope it becomes important to you and I hope you stick around because we’re dropping value bonds and we get back from thanking our sponsors. We all know how important engagement with our audience is. As creators, finding effective ways to provide value while also being able to interact in real time is a challenge. But now there’s Speak Easy. Speak Easy is an app that allows you to organize your own live talk show. It’s made by creators for creators and is uniquely built to help you monetize your audience whether you use it for live podcasting show recordings or hosting premium content people can subscribe to speakeasy has you covered want to stream private shows for select attendees you can do that too all you have to do is download the app go live and you’ll be connecting with an interactive audience immediately I’m loving creating daily content on speakeasy and I know you’re going to love it too. So what are you waiting for? Visit to download the app. Check me out at John Lee Dumas and let’s start rocking Speakeasy together. That’s I look forward to interacting with you, Fire Nation. Feeling connected to your team is a must, but with employees and contractors all over the globe, feeling that connection can be tough. Not to mention the software you use can sometimes make you feel out of sync like you and the rest of your team aren’t on the same page. And when a team is disconnected, your customers pay the price. If the software you’re currently using is sharing out of date data on your business or your customers, that equals trouble. Or maybe you feel like your software is making it impossible to see the full picture. If that’s the case, then listen up. Customers end up bearing the brunt of this disconnection, meaning a great customer experience is lost sometimes forever. Ready to get your team on the same page? HubSpot transforms everyday conversations, strategic decision-making sessions, and everything in between into moments customers feel good about. With a lovingly crafted suite of tools, you can seamlessly connect your team so everyone has access to the same data and you’re able to focus on what really matters, your customers. Learn how HubSpot can help your business grow better at Clay, Ryan, we’re back and I want to talk about hitting the repeat button. This is something that Clay, you do so well with yourself and with your clients. How can we systemize repeatable success? Well, what you do, I’ll just give an example. I want to brag on Ryan’s wife for a second. You know, when I first told Ryan and Rachel when they were new clients, I remember it was, and in this meeting, JLD, it always goes over really badly or really great. And it’s going to be, it’s like a, we go one way or the other in this meeting. I tell the clients, I say, now, listen, now that we have more leads, now that we have the branding improved, the branding looks great, the website looks great, leads are coming, and now we need to install call recording. Now, this show’s recorded, right? So anybody can listen to the show and they can say, that guest was terrible or that guest was awesome. But anyway, the audio of this show lives on for a long time. All right, so everybody hears how this show goes. It’s one take. We’re not editing it. You just hear it, boom, slide, boom. So when you’re doing calls, those sales calls, you say, thank you for calling Tip Top K9. This is Clay. How can I help you? The way that someone answers the phone is a big factor as to whether that customer becomes a customer or not, whether that lead converts into a customer or not. If the person answering the phone sounds sarcastic, unengaged, disengaged, unfocused, if they sound confused, if they sound unaware, uninformed, uneducated, the ideal and likely buyer that you worked so hard to woo and to wow, that lead that you tried to generate becomes a dormant lead, a dead lead, and the lead dies on the vine. So what we had to do is install call recording. I recommend a company called,, but you can use whatever you want to use. So we put the call recording in place, then we have to write a script, so the team has to follow a script, and the calls have to be recorded. And Ryan’s wife, Rachel, she not only insisted that the calls were recorded, and she insisted that the team follow the script, but she did it with a spirit of excellence and joy. And now he has an incredible call center. So anybody who owns a tip top canine franchise, they no longer have to answer their own phones at all. And Ryan, maybe you could talk about that process because most business owners, when you tell them that their team needs to follow a script and that the calls need to be recorded for quality assurance, most business owners say that sounds terrible. Yeah, so it was still every Sunday, our office manager listens to recorded phone calls, and then they play them on Monday. So as a team, they’re going over all the calls to make sure everyone’s following the script, and it handles about 98% of all the issues. And then what we did with Clay is we have around like version 17 is to start with, every week we come in and be like, hey, this is what broke. Hey, this is what broke. And then after listening to the calls, you could see where they couldn’t make it, and then we just kept tweaking that. 17 iterations. We’re on version 17 of the script and once we finally set it, we’ve been able to stick with that consistently. But early on we were doing a lot of changes and now JLD, the one thing we’re working on with Tip Top, which is exciting, is for a variety of reasons, a lot of people are willing to leave a corporate America. I think a lot of times it’s because people listen to great shows like yours and they start to say, you know what, I want to own my own business. For one reason or another, they’re tired of the corporate compliance, and they feel like they’re done working for the big box store. They want to go own their own thing. So now Ryan today, I would say, about every week, it seems like you’re meeting with somebody who wants to open a tip-top canine and trying to figure out if they’re a good fit or not. And really, we’re scaling the business to a level where financial freedom is now 100% – Ryan and his wife, they now have financial freedom. They now have the time freedom to go back to where we started to now you can focus on your passion. And I believe Ryan, you just recently purchased some chickens, am I correct? Yeah, I did, I bought some chickens. So now he’s pursuing his passion, which is chicken buying. Do you like fresh eggs? Is that anything you want? Oh, love the fresh eggs. Okay, I got it. Okay, that’s good. I eat like four or five eggs a day. So, Clay, you teach entrepreneurs how to create branding that enhances, not diminishes, we’re talking enhances perceived value. Tell us more. Yeah, so we’re gonna go right now, and we’re gonna go to, we’re gonna go to, we’re gonna go to, and we’re gonna go to These are the three brands that I work with intimately, so I’m trying to give you some examples here. If you go to, O-X-I, we just now passed 475 locations. Can I get an amen? Folks, this business went from one location to 475 locations. And whether you like the website or not, that’s up to you. You go to the website,, and if you look at it and go, that’s terrible. Well, you know what? You’re correct because you’re the consumer. And so you as a consumer are going to decide whether to buy or not buy from a business almost instantly. It’s the first impression. Then you go to and you’re gonna decide whether you’re interested or not interested based on that first impression. Another example would be, the home builder I was telling you about. So what we have to do with branding, is we have to understand that branding is simply a perception. So the way I describe branding is a good friend of mine named Michael Levine, he used to be the PR consultant for Nike, for Pizza Hut, for Michael Jordan, check this out folks, for George Bush and Bill Clinton. So if you don’t like George Bush, you don’t like Bill Clinton, either way, he did both. He worked both on both sides. And one of the things he told me is he said, Clay, branding is nothing other than gift wrapping. So he said, if you were to give a woman a ring and you gave her the ring and you gave it to her and it was packaged in a Kmart box, no offense to any Kmart employees out there, but if you got on one knee and you said will you marry me and you pull Out the Kmart box a lot of women would go Did you buy my ring at Kmart? Are you kidding me? You know they would reject the packaging now if you got on the knee on the one round the one knee and you got out And you pulled out a ring and you presented it in a Tiffany box a Tiffany box They would go oh wow this is awesome, and there would be an immediate reaction. So what’s wild though is if you were a very deceitful person, and none of your listeners are, but you had a really, really cheap ring that you bought and you put it in a Tiffany box, most people would perceive the ring, the cheap ring in the Tiffany box as having higher value than the ring, even a high quality ring, put it in a Kmart box. So what happens, as we have to understand, is we gift wrap everything as a culture. We gift wrap websites, we gift wrap politicians, we gift wrap musicians and celebrities, and people do judge you based upon the appearance of that first appearance they see. When we went to, and you’ll have to correct me because my memory gets worse over time, but on I believe we went and we enhanced the website almost immediately. Yes. And yellow is your color. Yellow is our color. Well actually we did the logo first, business cards, flyers, and then once you got the look then we started making the website match the look. We did your logo? Yeah you did the logo. I don’t remember that. Okay so we did the logo. Yeah I had an older like shield-ish. Okay. Yeah. So we did the logo and then we did an auto wrap for all the vehicles. Yep. Auto wrap and then all of our sales sheets, our flyers. We got rid of the Word document sheets that I had. So everything is branded and it’s designed to appeal to your ideal and likely buyers. So if you’re listening right now and you say, I went to and I don’t like it. The question is, does your ideal and likely buyer like it? You see, so for, I want people to fathom this. A man by the name of Jonathan Barnett had a vision to start the world’s greenest carpet cleaner. And he had done it. He had created the world’s greenest carpet cleaning process. It uses 10 times less water than almost every carpet cleaner in America. However, we needed more ideal and likely buyers because most businesses that fell by the way have a great idea or a great product. They just don’t sell anything. And if you can’t sell your business goes to hell. So we worked with Jonathan Barnett, with We’ve worked with Ryan with We’ve worked with And all I’m trying to do is make sure that the branding matches the expectations of your ideal and likely buyer. So the question is, when you look at these websites,,,, or whatever your business is, I want you to ask yourself this question if you’re listening right now. Does your website meet the expectations of your ideal and likely buyer? Does your website, does your branding, does your marketing, does your logo, do your print pieces, do they appeal to your ideal and likely buyer? And right here on my desk right now, I have a business card that was given to me by a guy named Vito Servadio. He gave this to me at a birthday party I was at this week, and he happens to, but the business card he gave me was phenomenal. It’s like a sharp business card. It’s company’s called Only the Best. It’s a firearms company. But this card is hot, you know, and he gave it to me. And right away I go, that is a great looking business card. And it’s because it’s a metal card. You want to keep it. You want to stick around. Another example would be, think about the packaging of an iPad. Everybody who buys an iPad, they want to keep the packaging of the iPad and they don’t know why. What are we, are we going to use the packaging to re-gift next year? What are we doing? But people always want to keep the Apple packaging because the branding is so good. Fire Nation, think about that. Think about the power of branding. And I love all the examples that you gave, Clay. And as I’m hearing you talk, I’m going through tip top K9. And that, by the way, is the letter K, the number nine. And whose idea was it, Ryan, it might’ve been yours, to have the dog balancing on top of the fire hydrant. Yeah, that’s mine. That is so classic. I mean, Fire Nation, it’s worth it just going to That’s our police command. Does Doggy time out? We teach him to go to a box, a chair, a stool, and we do use the fire hydrant just to show off. The letter K, the number nine. So tiptop, the letter K, the number Testimonials, and as always, Clay just crushes it with testimonials as well. And I’m looking at all these testimonials you have. I mean, it’s literally countless, but I mean, it’s just, it’s like, wow, if there’s this many testimonials, this must be the best canine trainer, literally in the world. And people go to search engines every single day, Clay, because they want to find solutions to their problems. How do you teach your students to dominate search engine results? Well, what we do, and by the way, if anybody’s listening right now, and you go to forward slash EO fire, if you’re listening right now, any of your listeners can attend one of our in-person two-day workshops. And the way I do it, GLD, is I tell people, you can pay $250 for a ticket or whatever you wanna pay. So somebody could say, I think I’m gonna pay $5, so I’m gonna try it. That’s fine, I don’t care, okay? It’s law of reciprocity. So far, everybody who’s ever attended our workshops loves it. They go and tell their friends and family. But at the workshops, I do a full multiple hour presentation on how to do this, but I’m going to sum it up into four quick points. There’s four variables that impact your rank on the search engines. Variable number one, you have to have a website that is canonically compatible with Google’s compliant standards. It has to be canonically compliant, or you would call it Google compliant. Does it adhere to the Google standards? Does it follow their canon of rules? Is it canonically compliant? The second, is it mobile compliant? What? By whose standard? By Google standard, is your website mobile compliant? The third is, whoever has the most original HTML content, whoever has the most original, relevant HTML content, that’s hypertext markup language content, gets to be taught for that subject. And four, it’s whoever has the most objective reviews. So I can help a business owner very quickly as part of our consulting program. What I do is I charge people $1,700 a month to grow their business. It’s month to month. And with that package, I do include photography, videography, web development, search engine, all those things. But where I make my money, JLD, being very transparent with the listeners, I make a 20% margin with every client I work with. So I make $340 a month per client on average. It’s month to month. So I’m not getting rich off that. It’s $54,400 a month of profit I generate off the 160 clients but where I make most of my money is I get a small percentage of the growth. That’s where I camp out. That’s where I make most of my money is a small percentage of the growth. That’s where I love to be. And so when I work with a client, I tell the client right away, hey listen, we need to make your website canonically compliant and I have web developers that work here full time and they work with the client and we knock it out right away, boom. Then I tell them, we need to make it mobile compliant, boom. But the third thing, the third area that I cannot do, that’s why I wanna brag on Ryan with Tip Top Canine, I wanna brag on OxiFresh, I wanna brag on, I cannot gather objective Google reviews from clients that are not happy, I can’t do it. Furthermore, I cannot, I just can’t do it. I cannot write original HTML content for a client unless they either do it themselves or they encourage my staff to do it for them. So I’d say 95% of my clients, JLD, they prefer not to write massive amounts of keyword-rich hypertext markup language content so they have us write it for them. And then, you know, and then the Google reviews, that’s something that Ryan and his team get. They get video reviews and Google reviews. Ryan, can you kind of explain the process that you use to go about getting those reviews and why you’ve chosen to have my team write the content for you? Yeah, as far as choosing you guys to use the content is, we started out writing our own content and that’s not fun. Soul sucking. Yeah. So we had a lot of other stuff to do, so that’s definitely not worth it, in my opinion. But yeah. Now, get in the reviews. What about getting the reviews? The reviews, first off, we’ve got to wow the client. I’ve got to really bring it when we train their dog, either when we boot camp it and take it and train her to do the lessons. And then we just ask them. We ask them for a review. And my people, they all get bonuses if they get reviews. They get pretty hefty bonuses. So you provide a wow, and then you ask for the review. Yeah, we provide a wow and ask for the review. Now I’ll say this here, JLD, real quick. I want everyone to look this up. Type in carpet cleaning quotes into Google, folks. Type it in right now. Carpet cleaning quotes. Did you know that, one of my longtime clients, they are the highest and most reviewed business in America of any type? Wow, 236,973 reviews. There it is. And someone says, that’s hyperbole. Look it up, folks. I’m telling you. I give you facts. That’s a big part of the Chet Holmes ultimate sales machine experience, by the way. Big shout out to the Chet Holmes legacy, to his daughter, to anybody connected with that organization, they are the best. But I’m telling you, you gotta get those reviews. It’s called puffery if you’re making stuff up. You wanna cite your sources, okay? That’s why I give people examples, ample examples that the humans can handle. Also, it’s very important to understand this. When you go to You know in 2006, 2006, that was the first year that a client called me and said, could you help me grow my business? And at that point, JLD, I had built America’s largest wedding DJ entertainment company. I’d built a massive photography company. I’d built a commercial real estate business. I’d been building my own companies. I never wanted to be a marketing consultant business growth guy. And I remember I had a dentist and an insurance agent. They said, could you help me grow my business? And this, as God is my witness, this dentist tripled the size of his dental practice. And I said, hey, Dr. Lindsey, could you record on video about your growth? Because no one’s going to believe it. And he goes, yeah, sure. So I put it up there, Then I talked to the insurance agent. I said, hey, no one’s going to believe you’re Oklahoma’s largest insurance agent where you used to struggle. Could you record a video? Boom. So if you look at those videos, as of right now, as of today, we now have over 2,000 client success stories where we have over tripled the size of someone’s business. They’re all documented. And JLT, that’s why I believe that our program is so successful. One, because the current clients know, wow, other people can do it. I can do it, too. And the other thing is that people have seen the validators and they know, wow, the proof is in the pudding. Success leaves trails. And it’s all documented right there at Fire Nation, slash EO Fire. I mean, check it out. He has so much stuff going on there. Ryan and Clay, I mean, I want to end with a bang here. Let’s take our time because, I mean, there’s just been so many value bombs. I just don’t want any to sneak through the cracks here. But let’s start with you, Ryan. What is the one major takeaway that you really want Fire Nation to get from everything that we’ve talked about from all the value bonds we’ve dropped What do you want to make sure our listeners really? Understand yeah, I would say I wanted to really understand that it doesn’t matter How good you are at your craft if you don’t have repeatable systems, and they’re not scripted out You’re not gonna succeed in replacing yourself. What so it doesn’t matter. How you are you just want a job, you don’t necessarily own a business. We tripled our income, right? While growing to 17 locations and doing product support and doing a call center and billing support for the location. So that was in five years. So we tripled my location while we’re training 17 others. So I couldn’t have done that without Heart System. Clay, bring us home. What is it you really want to make sure Fire Nation gets in this conversation? Give us that strong call to action so we can have more success stories from you, Fire Nation, our listeners. Take action. Well, you got three ways that you can get rich that I can. You people always say, you know, can I get rich quick? I could definitely guarantee that somebody can become wealthy if they follow these proven systems. I can do that. And by the way, if you start working at the age of 20 and you want to become a millionaire by the age of 40, you need to save about $175 a day. I know that because I’ve done the math. So you need to save $175 a day and then don’t die. Stop, drop, and roll, look both ways while crossing traffic, that kind of thing. But you save $175 a day. But if you want to get wealthier faster, what you want to do is you want to look at the three situations. One, you could go out there and open your own business. That’s the thing I specialize in teaching people at forward slash EO Fire. I can teach you how to grow a successful company. So if you have a company, you want to grow it, that’s what I do. I’d love to help you. Boom. The first consultation is free. The workshops are interactive. You can learn more of, again, the first consultation is free at forward slash EO fire. Two, you could buy an existing business model. You would call that franchising or licensing. I gave you two examples today, but there’s other ones I didn’t give you. I mean, you could become a state farm agent. You could open a tip-top canine. You could open a pedominos pizza. You could open up an oxy-fresh. The reason why I wanted to have Ryan on today’s show is he’s a client I’ve worked with for a long time. We’ve successfully helped him to franchise, and it’s pretty awesome what he can do, and it’s less than $50,000 to open up a location. And there are some franchises you can look into, like buying a McDonald’s is over $2 million today. So, you know, buying a franchise is a great option. You just want to make sure it’s affordable for you. And the third thing you can do, and this is something I don’t know that I can do it. You have to be a genius. Now, somebody out there says, I am a genius. That’s great. But I’m talking about like Steve Jobs invented, you know, the modern computer systems that we have today. He’s a genius. He revolutionized the music industry. He’s a genius. Michael Jordan could play basketball in a way that Marvin Gaye could sing. If you’re a genius, if you have that supernatural, God-given talent where you can sing songs and play basketball and invent stuff, you don’t need me, because if you’re so great that the world can’t ignore you, that right there is awesome. But for the average person like myself, I’ll put myself in that category, where you’re not the next LeBron James, you’re not the next Oprah, you’re not the next Marvin Gaye. You probably need to go back to move one or two. So either you want to grow a proven, learn how to grow a business using proven systems with what we teach at forward slash EO fire. Or you want to buy a franchise or license an existing system which you can learn more about at And again, there’s other options too. I mean State Farm is a great brand. I’m not affiliated with them in any way, shape or form. Domino’s is a great brand. I mean, there’s so many. Jimmy John’s is a great brand. What I like about Tip Top though is it’s $50,000 or less, whereas a lot of the other opportunities that exist in franchising do cost people millions of dollars. Fire Nation, you can see why Clay has made his 10th appearance on Fire Nation because he brings the fire, he brings the heat, and he brings the results. Because you’re the average of the five people you spend the most time with. You’ve been hanging out with Clay and Ryan in JLD today, so keep up the heat. If you head over to, type Clay, you will see the show notes page with links to everything as well as the other nine shows that he did and I promise you, they were all amazing. slash EOFire. slash EOFire. If you wanna start taking steps in the right direction with your life and business, Fire Nation, get on a free consultation call with Clay. Take advantage of this, because I can guarantee you he may not be able to do this forever because he only has so much time, energy, and effort he can put into this. But Clay, Ryan, I want to say thank you for sharing your truth, knowledge, value with Fire Nation today. For that, we salute you, and we’ll catch you both on the flip side. Boom! Thanks, man. Hey, Fire Nation, a big thank you to Clay Ryan and our sponsors for sponsoring today’s episode. And Fire Nation, if you want productivity, discipline, and focus in your life, the Mastery Journal is for you. Visit, and in 100 days, you’ll master productivity, you’ll master focus, you’ll master discipline. The Thrive Time Show two-day interactive business workshops are the world’s highest rated and most reviewed business workshops. Because we teach you what you need to know to grow. You can learn the proven 13 point business systems that Dr. Zellner and I have used over and over to start and grow successful companies. We get into the specifics, the specific steps on what you need to do to optimize your website. We’re gonna teach you how to fix your conversion rate. We’re gonna teach you how to do a social media marketing campaign that works. How do you raise capital? How do you get a small business loan? We teach you everything you need to know here during a two-day, 15-hour workshop. It’s all here for you. You work every day in your business, but for two days you can escape and work on your business and build these proven systems so now you can have a successful company that will produce both the time freedom and the financial freedom that you deserve. You’re going to leave energized, motivated, but you’re also going to leave empowered. The reason why I built these workshops is because as an entrepreneur, I always wish that I had this. And because there wasn’t anything like this, I would go to these motivational seminars, no money down, real estate, Ponzi scheme, get motivated seminars, and they would never teach me anything. It was like you went there and you paid for the big chocolate Easter bunny, but inside of it, it was a hollow nothingness. And I wanted the knowledge, and they’re like, oh, but we’ll teach you the knowledge after our next workshop. And the great thing is we have nothing to upsell. At every workshop, we teach you what you need to know. There’s no one in the back of the room trying to sell you some next big, get rich quick, walk on hot coals product. It’s literally, we teach you the brass tacks, the specific stuff that you need to know to learn how to start and grow a business. I encourage you to not believe what I’m saying and I want you to Google the Z66 auto auction. I want you to Google elephant in the room. Look at Robert Zellner and Associates. Look them up and say are they successful because they’re geniuses or are they successful because they have a proven system? When you do that research you will discover that the same systems that we use in our own business can be used in your business. Come to Tulsa, book a ticket, and I guarantee you it’s gonna be the best business workshop ever. And we’re gonna give you your money back if you don’t love it. We’ve built this facility for you, and we’re excited to see it. And now you may be thinking, what does it actually cost to attend an in-person two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshop? Well, good news, the tickets are $250 or whatever price that you can afford. What? Yes, they’re $250 or whatever price you can afford. I grew up without money and I know what it’s like to live without money. So if you’re out there today and you want to attend our in-person, two-day interactive business workshop, all you’ve got to do is go to to request those tickets and if you can’t afford $250, we have scholarship pricing available to make it affordable tickets and if you can’t afford $250, we have scholarship pricing available to make it affordable for you.


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