Neri Karra Sillaman | Why Every Super Successful Entrepreneur Has Gone Through Massive Struggle + The 6 Language Speaking, PhD. & Entrepreneur Shares 8 Principles of Business Success from Immigrant Entrepreneurs

Audio Transcription

Transcribed with Cockatoo

(Speaker 4)
Some shows don’t need a celebrity narrator to introduce the show, but this show does. In a world filled with endless opportunities, why would two men who have built 13 multi -million dollar businesses altruistically invest five hours per day to teach you the best practice business systems and moves that you can use? Because they believe in you, and they have a lot of time on their hands. They started from the bottom, now they’re here. It’s the Thrive Time Show starring the former U .

(Speaker 12)
S.

(Speaker 2)
Small Business Administration’s Entrepreneur of the Year, Clay Clark, and the entrepreneur trapped inside an optometrist’s body, Dr. Robert Zunder. Two men, eight kids, co -created by two different women, 13 multi -million dollar businesses. We started from the bottom, now we’re at the top. Teaching you the systems to get what we got. Colton Dixon’s on the hooks. I break down the books.

(Speaker 2)
He’s bringing some stump and the good looks. As the father, that’s why I’m up.

(Speaker 5)
So if you see my wife and kids, please, it’s the CNC up on your radio. And now, let’s go.

(Speaker 2)
Ladies and gentlemen, on today’s show, we’re interviewing an entrepreneurship expert at Oxford University and the author of a book called Pioneers, Eight Principles of Business Longevity from Immigrant Entrepreneurs. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, she’s a PhD. She’s sort of a big deal. Niri, welcome on to the Thrive Time Show.

(Speaker 1)
How are you? I’m good, Clay. This is such an energizing introduction. I love it.

(Speaker 2)
Now, I know there’s a lot of people that are on the verge of losing their minds or trying to figure out how to pronounce your last name properly. Clarify the controversy. What’s the proper way to pronounce your last name there, ma ‘am?

(Speaker 1)
It’s actually an American last name. My husband is American, so Sivlaman.

(Speaker 2)
OK, there is the controversy.

(Speaker 11)
It’s easy.

(Speaker 2)
The controversy is settled. Now, you wrote this book, Pioneers, Eight Principles of Business Longevity from Immigrant Entrepreneurs. What motivated you to write this book?

(Speaker 1)
Well, I am an immigrant entrepreneur myself. So it is a very it’s a very personal book to me. And it comes from a very personal space. I’ve been researching the topic starting with my PhD, which was almost 20 years ago, and it was about ethnic, my research focused on ethnic entrepreneurship. And then about a year and a half ago, I came across this statistic, which said nearly 50 % of Fortune 500 companies are founded by immigrants. 80 % of the billion dollar startups have a founder or an executive, top level executives, who is an immigrant.

(Speaker 1)
And immigrant founded businesses last longer, statistically. than their counterparts. So for me, this is a significant, and this is not only in the US, by the way, you have the same statistics, very similar ones in UK, in Asia, in the rest of the world. But when we look at the academic literature, it focuses only on this question and answering this question, why are immigrants more likely to start a company. But nobody asked the question, why are they more likely start businesses that last?

(Speaker 1)
And that’s what my book answers.

(Speaker 2)
Now, you fled Bulgaria, is my understanding. Could you share with us a little bit about your background or how you ended up in America?

(Speaker 8)
Sure.

(Speaker 1)
I am now, well, I was born in Bulgaria to a Turkish ethnic minority family. And we lived during communism. And unfortunately, the communist government at the time decided to carry out an ethnic assimilation process against Turkish ethnic minorities. That meant they will change our names forcibly. So if you had a Turkish name, you were given a Bulgarian name. You were not allowed to practice your religion or your culture.

(Speaker 1)
And this was my entire childhood. I remember being taken from our home, forcibly fleeing with my parents in order to avoid our names getting changed. And then in June of 1989, the communist dictator of the country came on TV and said, if you have Turkish ethnicity, you need to leave the country. So we can only take two suitcases. And we took two suitcases. I was 11 years old.

(Speaker 1)
My brother was nine. And we basically became refugees. We initially were set up to stay at a refugee camp, which was set up by the Red Cross. And that’s where I began life, a new life with my parents and my younger brother.

(Speaker 2)
Now, you speak probably better English than I speak today. Did you speak any English when you came over to America?

(Speaker 1)
I did, of course. I came to University of Miami on financial aid. as an understudent at the University of Miami program. I started learning English at the age of seven in Bulgaria, and I’m the first one in my family to ever learn English and speak English.

(Speaker 2)
How many languages do you speak total?

(Speaker 1)
Turkish, Russian, Bulgarian, Italian, English, a little bit of French.

(Speaker 2)
You speak six languages?

(Speaker 1)
I didn’t count them, but yes.

(Speaker 2)
Let’s recap one more time. You said Turkish.

(Speaker 1)
Bulgarian.

(Speaker 9)
Got it.

(Speaker 2)
Two.

(Speaker 10)
English.

(Speaker 2)
Three.

(Speaker 1)
Russian.

(Speaker 9)
Four.

(Speaker 1)
Italian.

(Speaker 2)
Five.

(Speaker 1)
And a little bit of French.

(Speaker 2)
Six. That’s incredible.

(Speaker 1)
Five and a half.

(Speaker 2)
Now, let me ask, when you get mad, what language do you think it?

(Speaker 1)
English. That’s really funny, but English.

(Speaker 9)
Really?

(Speaker 2)
So if you stub your toe or you can’t find your keys and you get upset about something, you’re thinking English?

(Speaker 1)
Yes, I do.

(Speaker 2)
Really?

(Speaker 1)
Okay. It’s the language I’m most comfortable in. And to my son, I actually spoke, I have a six -year -old, almost seven -year -old. I have spoken to him in English since he was born.

(Speaker 2)
I tried speaking in Turkish, but it just didn’t feel natural. You know, I am absolutely fascinated when I hear about people that have fled a country and they turned bitterness, or what could be bitterness, into betterness. And I applaud your story and your journey. And I want to ask you, in your new book here, you talk about these eight principles of business longevity from immigrant entrepreneurs. I’ve got my stack of stuff, my notes of things I want to go over with you. Talk to me about these eight principles that immigrant entrepreneurs have been using to build businesses.

(Speaker 2)
I know that’s a lot of things.

(Speaker 8)
talk about at one time, but tell us about these eight principles.

(Speaker 1)
Sure. I categorize them as eight principles after interviewing some of the world’s leading immigrant entrepreneurs that built some of the most impressive companies that I would say changed the world. Duolingo, WhatsApp, Moderna, BioNTech, Dermalogica, Numity, you name it, MGA Entertainment. And basically, I wanted to understand what allowed them to create these businesses that changed the world and created the impact that it did. And my answers, I categorize them into eight principles. The first one, I call it be a bridge across cultures.

(Speaker 1)
And that’s the most obvious one because they are, of course, born to a different culture to a different country. And when they immigrate, they become a bridge between two different cultures. Because some of the time, where does a business idea come from? Some of the time, this comes from their past. So they will use their past, their past informs their current business idea. And I detail in the book, how Another person who is not from an immigrant background can apply the same thing to his or her own company.

(Speaker 1)
The second principle is building from the past forward and the future back because And this is a very detailed exercise that I have in the book that I take a potential or existing entrepreneur by hand and allow them to create the vision for their own company. And many of the, for example, Moderna, they built and they create with the question of what if, and they have, they created from the future, from the future back. They first start with a vision. And what does it need to happen in order for me to get here? What problem am I solving?

(Speaker 1)
And what will, what is the solution? And how will that solution become? But they are very present when they do it. The third one has to do with forging connections based on their own identity. And I talk about that homophilic ties, that’s the terminology that is used academically. But basically, you can create and build your own family, your own tribe, by using some of the principles that immigrant entrepreneurs do.

(Speaker 1)
For example, when they move to a new country, they tend to, first of all, come from places that value connections that value community. And when they immigrate to a new country, they most of the time lose the connections that they have. And they will use strategic storytelling. They will try to find the commonality with the person that they come in touch with. And that basically allows them to create a very strong bond, whether it’s with their suppliers or distributors or the customers they come in contact with. And again, they don’t have to come from the same culture as that person, but the essence of community matters greatly to them.

(Speaker 1)
And when they start to build the business, they are focused with shared value. How can what we do benefit both of us, benefit all of us? Profit, of course, is important in a business, but that’s not the only thing that drives them forward. So I talk a lot in the book about community and that I give Chobani as an example there because he was able to build his business by relying on community, on people. And my other principle is about reframing rejection because immigrant entrepreneurs, of course, they are highly resilient and no is not is not, doesn’t mean the same to them.

(Speaker 1)
So when they hear a no, or when they face a failure or rejection, they have a way of reframing that. They even will reframe their painful past and use that as a source of strength in the future and in the present. And the last one, I think, I think I’m in the last one was about luck and how Luck is not this outside event that happens to them, but it’s a very, they use, they make luck happen, and they put themselves in the way of luck. And that’s why I titled it Dare to Play Your Own Hand.

(Speaker 2)
So in summary, those are my eight principles. So if somebody’s watching this right now and they go, you know what? I am not an immigrant from another country and I am blessed with being born in these United States.

(Speaker 1)
What do you believe every listener can do right now to immediately apply one of those eight principles in their own life and business? So I didn’t write the book for immigrants. And in a way that I characterize immigrants, you become a parent, you are, you know, I would say you become an immigrant because you left how you used to live. Now you have to live a certain way. And anyone, everyone faces challenges in life. You don’t have to

(Speaker 1)
be an immigrant in order to say, you know, I’m blessed and I have no issues. But they can apply all the principles that I’ve stated. All of them apply for non -immigrant businesses.

(Speaker 2)
I simply use immigrants as an example in order to understand how can I create a business that lasts. Now, where do you believe most entrepreneurs are likely to get it wrong if they don’t read your book?

(Speaker 1)
If somebody doesn’t read your book, if they don’t pick it up, if they don’t read the book, where is somebody going to get it wrong by default? Very good question. There is two, because I work with startups and I advise them for their strategy and growth. There is two issues that I see. The one is basically has to do, I titled it frying your own oil. I think when you are a startup, you immediately go for outside investment or you want to raise money and you think this is going to be good for the business.

(Speaker 1)
But what I’ve seen in the book, and if you want to have a business with stable foundations, when you don’t immediately go for investment, that actually strengthens your company. This is proven by research. And I’ve seen it in every single entrepreneur I interviewed. I’ve seen it in my own company. When you don’t get this outside injection of money, you are basically forced to fry in your own oil, which allows you to have a much stronger foundation. It allows you to really hone in your capability as a company.

(Speaker 1)
You become a lot more creative. The second one has to do with fast growth. Today, we want everything to be fast. We want new product lines. We want to expand to a new country.

(Speaker 1)
We want to open yet another store, yet another factory. But that usually can stretch your resources too much and in a way that usually derails the success of a business. So it’s these two principles that I think, where most startups and most existing businesses even tend to fail. You have businesses who say, let’s get into this market. It’s going to give us more profitability. It’s going to be more expansion.

(Speaker 2)
But growth for the sake of growth or not really having a very strong foundation, not watching your cash flow, and relying on outside investment is where I see the mistakes happen. Now, in your book, you talk about this idea that billion -dollar companies have been able to turn personal struggles into lasting business models. You’ve studied some of the biggest companies. You’ve studied billion -dollar companies. And somehow, they found a way to turn their struggles into a business model. How often is it that the founder of a company has gone through massive struggle before achieving massive success?

(Speaker 1)
How often do you find that massive struggle has happened before the massive success? All the time, every single person I interviewed in my book, every single immigrant entrepreneur, and you will be surprised because today you see them as billionaires perhaps, but Isaac Larian, he’s a billionaire. He’s the founder of MGA Entertainment. When he came to US, he had couple of hundreds of dollars and I think at the time he was 17. He was born in Iran. He is Jewish -Iranian and he decides to come to

(Speaker 1)
US, 17 years old, doesn’t know anyone. The money that he only had the blanket that his mother knitted for him. He gets to Los Angeles and he’s surprised that the money that he thought was a lot, basically he runs out of money very quickly, as you would. He starts to look for a job and he goes from gas station to restaurants all day long, walking and asking for anyone, any jobs, just to anything. He will clean toilets, he will work at a gas station, day after day after day. And then he walks into a restaurant and says, do you have any jobs available?

(Speaker 1)
They say no. And he gets outside of the restaurant. He sits down. He’s just at the end of the rope, basically, as they say. And then there is a pat on his shoulder. It’s the chef of the restaurant that heard him and says, Iranian?

(Speaker 1)
Are you Iranian?” And says to him, come here, I will let you wash the dishes after 11 o ‘clock. And it’s this same persistence that I saw in Isaac Larian when he wants to bring Nintendo. By the way, he becomes an, he goes to engineering school, he puts himself through school. He goes, he realizes when he is in Japan, he sees all these kids, teenagers with these devices, Nintendo, and says, if I brought this to US, this is going to sell. But the CEO of Nintendo is not interested at all.

(Speaker 1)
It’s a, I don’t want to go into too much detail, but he’s very persistent day after day, again and again, goes to the office of Nintendo and says, I want to bring your brand to US. It’s this commonality why I told this story into detail, something that he struggled to find a job as a 17 -year -old penniless without speaking English very well even.

(Speaker 2)
He applies the same thing when he tries to build a business. I’m going to pull up your website real quick. I’m going to pull up Amazon so people can see this book cover. I want people to see your book here. How many people did you interview in this book?

(Speaker 1)
When you’re putting together Pioneers, Eight Principles of Business Longevity from Immigrant Entrepreneurs, how many entrepreneurs have you interviewed? I have the list in the book. I’ve listed them. I think it’s about 35.

(Speaker 2)
But again, Clay, this has been 20 years of personal research experience, and I’ve selected the companies for a very specific reason, because A, I wanted them to be immigrants, and I wanted them to have started businesses of impact, long -lasting businesses. What fires you up to run around writing these books, researching, sharing this message? Why do you do it?

(Speaker 1)
What motivates you? This is a very personal book. I think What motivates me is because I just, I’m very curious person in general, but I realized this particular story has not been told. Why are immigrants more likely to start businesses that last? And I had to do it. And the book flew out of me as they say, because

(Speaker 1)
I wrote it in six months. But I would be at my desk very early in the morning, right until the evening. And I was in my pajamas the whole time to the point when, with my husband, we went for a date night after about five months or so of me writing. And I said, I think I should put on more makeup. I feel really good. And he said, well, maybe it’s not the makeup.

(Speaker 1)
You can start getting out of your pajamas. It was to that extent.

(Speaker 2)
That’s how much focused I was. Wow.

(Speaker 1)
Now, your book has been featured in and you’ve been featured in The Financial Times, Bloomberg, The Guardian, Fortune, Forbes, Harvard Business Review, Ideacast. Why do you believe this message is resonating with so many people? because we all want to live better lives. That’s why, because my book is not just about building a successful business.

(Speaker 2)
It touches people because it’s also about building a better life, living your life on purpose, living your life on courage.

(Speaker 1)
And the fact that immigrants who had absolutely nothing created these very successful businesses, I would imagine it sparks curiosity in others. Now, for anybody out there who’s not familiar with your work, where’s the best place people should go to if they want to learn more about you and your career? They can go to my website, naryspeaks . com.

(Speaker 2)
And you can find me on LinkedIn, narykarasilaman. And I have an Instagram, prof . nary. I’m going to pull up your website real quick. And you can tell me if I’m going to the right website and make sure I’m not on the wrong website, folks. And again, everybody who’s driving in your car right now,

(Speaker 2)
maybe you wait till you get to a moment where it’s a good ideal time to pull this up. Give me just a second, folks. I’m pulling up. You shouldn’t be pulling up websites while doing an interview, folks, but that’s what I’m doing.

(Speaker 1)
I’m sacrificing for you, folks.

(Speaker 2)
I’m pulling up a website while doing an interview. Here he is. Oh, yeah. NeriSpeaks . com, I put it in there, see N -E -R -I, and then Speaks . com, I go there, bam, that’s your website, that’s you.

(Speaker 2)
What kind of services do you provide? Are you a fashion consultant? What are you? You appear to be very fashionable. You speak six languages.

(Speaker 1)
Are you a speaking coach? Do you teach other languages? What are the services that you provide there, Ms. Neri? So I do keynote public speaking, and I’m represented by London Speaker Bureau.

(Speaker 2)
and I talk about topics on business longevity, what we can learn from immigrants, what resilience is, the myths of business longevity, and as well as what sustainability really means in business, how you can balance profit and sustainability, profit and purpose in business as well. So those are some of my topics. When it comes to fashion, we did start a fashion company, leather products company with my family, which is now in its 25th year, but I’m not in the fashion industry today. You are a fascinating individual. You got the fashion industry. You speak six languages, five and a half.

(Speaker 2)
You are a keynote speaker. You’re an author.

(Speaker 1)
How do you organize your day? Like on a personal level, how do you every day you wake up? How do you organize the first hour of every day? So the first hour, as soon as I wake up, you will maybe find this out, but I will immediately start writing. The second I open my eyes, and you can call it meditation in writing, but I will just whatever is in my mind out into the paper.

(Speaker 1)
And it’s almost looks like scribbling, but that’s my form of meditation. And then I will do a 10 minute gratitude meditation. And I start my day, try to, on a very positive note. And then I will be at my desk and work all day long. Usually it’s writing. Usually if I have to speak somewhere online, I would do that.

(Speaker 1)
I have students, well, they are graduates of Oxford University now, but I also advise startups. So I will probably have a session or two with them. And then I stop exactly at 4 p . m. because I go and pick up my son. and we will come home.

(Speaker 2)
I will help him with his homework, which I have to at this age supervise, otherwise he doesn’t want to do a homework. I’ll cook dinner. My husband comes from work and bedtime for our son at eight o ‘clock in the evening. Now, final question I have here for you. You’ve done a lot of interviews. You’re going to do a lot of other interviews, good interviews, bad interviews.

(Speaker 2)
I want this to at least not be in the bottom 2 % of all the interviews you’ve ever done. So I got to ask you, what is the question that you wish that I would have asked you on today’s show? Is there a certain question where you think to yourself and you go, man, I wish that guy would have asked me that.

(Speaker 1)
That guy, he did not ask me that. You get off the podcast, you say, I Wow, he didn’t even ask me this. What is the one question that you maybe wish that I would have asked you on today’s show? I don’t think this will be in there. I didn’t think. I don’t know.

(Speaker 1)
I think you asked a lot of good questions. I would say one thing. Some people ask me, how ambitious are you? And thinking, you know, equating ambition as being a bad thing. But I want to say to your listeners and you know, ambition actually allows you to be resilient and don’t be afraid of ambition because that’s the only way you can go. Let’s say you, this is life, you are going up, up, up, something happens, a setback, you are rejected, you lose your job, you are here.

(Speaker 1)
Now, ambition tells you, I can get back here again.

(Speaker 2)
and it’s ambition that will allow you to keep going. And it’s not this dark feeling that I think in today’s society we are taught to believe that it’s something to be looked down on. And so, yeah, when they ask me if I am ambitious, I would say I’m very grateful that I am ambitious because it allowed me to be where I am today. Neri, you are a living legend, a fashionista, a best -selling author, a researcher, a woman with a lot of hats that you wear well. Thank you for carving out time to be on the Thrive Time Show. We’re honored to have you on the show today.

(Speaker 1)
And thank you for turning what could have been a tough start in life into not bitterness, but into betterness. I really do appreciate you sharing your message.

(Speaker 2)
Thank you so much.

(Speaker 1)
Thank you, Clay.

(Speaker 6)
It was really a pleasure.

(Speaker 3)
Have a great day.

(Speaker 7)
You too.

(Speaker 6)
Bye -bye.

(Speaker 3)
character. It’s a good word for character. Yeah, that is it. Good, driven, smart. And I’ve never met a guy who was so hyper all the time. He’s doing so much good.

(Speaker 3)
And then I met his mother, and she just says, she just, she just lets him be Clay Clark.

(Speaker 7)
I mean, so, you know, he’s endorsed by his mother and he’s doing magnificent work. So it was great meeting you out there and all the people that he surrounds himself with.

(Speaker 3)
His Clay Clark starts his days at five o ‘clock in the morning.

(Speaker 6)
Oh, it’s incredible.

(Speaker 3)
Yeah. He’s, he’s like, he’s, he’s a machine. He’s a machine, but his, you know, I got, I have problems with my company starting at nine o ‘clock. Yes.

(Speaker 6)
about hundreds of people showing up at 5 a . m. in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Man, he’s a leader of a leader. He’s a fantastic young man. No, he is.

He is.

Transcribed with Cockatoo